Disappointing Sonu Nigam at London on Rafi songs
This article is written by Mr. K.S. Ramachandran
Sonu Nigam, much to my expectations, sang Rafi songs very normally. In fact, I would rate him much much lower than what he used to sing when he came in about 13years ago through Saregama. His voice has conspicuously deteriorated with his singing all types of medlee/Hindi pop songs and of that sort.
He was always a fast singer and now-a-days with his singing Hindi pop and medlees, he is even faster. His first song Yaad Na Jaaye from Dil Ek Mandir was like traveling in Nilgiri Express, while the original song by Rafi is slow deep expressive and extremely emotional. This was the general pattern in which Sonu has been singing these days with his impatient attitude to sing slow numbers very fast is very painful. “Muje Teri Mohabbat Ka” from Aap Aaye bahar Aaye” was again a deep number with full of rhythm and Sonu sang like a breeze..
Rafi songs are predominantly slow with rhythm and with so much of labour in his singing – be it depth, dard, range, voice modulation, expression, emotion and what have you.
I was however amazed with the orchestral excellence with the british national giving interlude music to the T. The 75 piece orchestra was par excellence and I could not find anything different from the original music by the composers. Indian orchestra bands doing shows should take this as an example to see how well the symphony was directed and delivered. Another wonderful experience – nothing like original and natural instruments – playing with a 30 team violin for the right interlude music was way way ahead of playing the same tunes today on a key board.
I thoroughly enjoyed the orchestra and was really a treat.
The prank Kishore fan is indeed a “gumnawala fankha”
Dear Kishore Fans,
Kishore Kumar as many might not be aware had his first wife namely Ramola who Kishore ka paagal pana dekhkar bhag gayee thee jo ab tak nahee milee, his second wife the beauty Madhubala ghar basane se pehle hee becharee guzar gayee, and his third wife Leena Chandavarkar ghar jaroor basane lagee lekin tab tak bechara Kishore khud is duniya se chala gaya.
His brothers Ashok and Anoop always used to say jitnee zindagee mein acting kee usse jyada usne filmon mein tamasha kiya aur sabse jyada nakhare woh recording room mein kiya karta tha as if he was the only singer in the industry. Gadha kahin ka!
I have always been a witness to many of the Kishore Kumar pranks & nakhras in the recording rooms. Ashok Kumar had publicly said “Kishore can never be a singer but a big joker as he really was”
Personaly speaking Kishore Kumar was a childish natured human being & mannerisms and hence I have always labelled him as the “nanhe munhe bachhe” He never ever grew up & never became serious.
Now his son Amit Kumar is equally and efficiently continuing his fathers legacy
I have several and innumerable of such instances & nakhras of dear Kishore Kumar filled with me and if the dear fans of Kishore Kumar want will be definitely be made available to them by me entirely free of cost.
Dostoon ab bhee sambhal jawo aur ho sake to sudhe bhee jawo warna ye Sandeep Nadkarni es se badkar es aise kafee Kishore ke nakhare aur uske pyaar bhare pentre bahar nikhalkar dikhla doonga phir na kehna humne badtameejee kee.
Hope better ideas will atleast now prevail upon the great kishore fans and if not than I will definitely remove my “Brahamaastra” which please note very importantly.
Is site pe kafee tamasha kiya jaldee yahan se bhag jawo warna?
70s was not about kishore kumar,,it was completly about Amitabh bachhan,,its being said that fan following of Amitabh bachhan in 70s was equivallent to Gandhiji`s of national movement.India always respect art,,,,in 70s everything in film industry started moving around Bachhan`s move,,,,soMr Bachhan`s song was destined to be a hit irrspective of singer,,,even “”Rang barse”” in amitabh bachhan voice is greater hit even today than Kishore kumar numbers in 70s ,Kishore kumar followed Amitabh bachhan wave,,,its not heroism,,but Rafi sahab can shatter stardom of anyone in or against the wave
….for example, there came a movie in 1977,,Amar Akbar Anthony,This movie was very important for Amitabh bachhan as in this movie bigB tried to prove himself versatile by playing his role with comic touch,,,,,he work hardest in the movie as it was very important for Amitabh`s future image,,,,but in this movie Both Kis kum n amitabh bachhan sang Anthony gonj song,,with masterpiece Rap by Amitabh bachhan,,,,,but,,,,its the first time someone face to face came to challenge even Amitabh bachhan`s stardom and that too behind the screen ,,he was mohammad rafi sahab,,,even mr bachhan couldn`t blv,,that the song,,parda hai parda and shirdi wale sai baba became bigger than the movie
,,Amitabh bachhan was hero of the movie,,,Hrishi kapoor no way stand anywhere close to stardom of Amitabh bachhan,,,,but people were behaving crazy and mersmerized with Rafi shab voice playbacked on Qawaal akbar…..,similarly in kalia,,major song was with kishore kumar,,,one song was on character pyarelal,,whose real name I don`t know,,the song is “kaun kis ko band saka hai”””,,what a heroic song and voice was,,this song was the theme of the movie…..
,,,has any film personality has ever got such a respect or tribute like Rafi sahab,the real hero,,when naseeb released after Rafi sahab death almost all leading film personality came to give tribute to Rafi sahab in movie in the song jan johni janardan playbacked on amitabh bachhan,,,,,Amitabh bachhan one of the most modest n highly respected living legend lied literay at Rafi sahab`s feet with reverence while recording song chal mere bhai,,,did he had same respect for kis kum though kis kum used to play back him,,,no~!!!!,,,,I`ve used Mr Bachhan`s name as most of kis kum hit is on him,yet amitabh bachhan`s fav singer was Rafi sahab,,,,how sarcastic is it for kishore fans ,,!!!it was very important Amitabh bachhan himself tributed Rafi sahab making guest appearnce after his ritirement announcement in the song with lyrics that no singer can be comapered with rafi sahab saying “Mohd Rafi tu bahut yaad aaya,”
So stop,making 70s story,,,,,,Rafi sahab is not limited to decades,,,he is eternal,,,best every moment,,,,,,n thanx for ur respect towards Binu sir,,,,,,plz maintain that,,n in hearts of his heart he know it very well, that no one can stand even close to Rafi sahab,,………
post 424,,,Bapan don`t teach us whats the meaning of modulation,heroism,n playback ability is,,,Sonu Nigham ji has all the three(even more than that) u mentioned,,,,,,,,,,,,,,forget rafi sahab,,,but if u insist,,let me tell u,,,when Ziddi released 1948,, devanand in Kis kum voice apeared to cry n as if shehgal sahab with sore throat giving playback,exactly same time came a song of Rafi sahab in 1949,,,Suhhani raat dhal chuki,na jane tum kab aaoge,,,,,if u don`t know,let me tell u the word modulation is derived from this song,,n u ref post 432,,,n playback as far as playback is concerned rafi sahab has playbacked most actors including ur kis kum n that too in different unique styles,,n heroism,,n what the hell u mean by younger generation loves Kishore kum more than rafi sahab,,,,okay,,,lets clear all the confusion,,,,,I`m also a youth and that too in modelling proffesion,so,I know with much details how fickle these so called youths are whom u mentioned,,,,they r like crow romaing restlessly everywhere with no contentment,,sometime there fav is hemesh reshamiya,,sometime mikka and few minutes Kis kum etc,,,,,,,but I know many youths who r Rafi sahab`s fan..they r rather Rafi lover,,,,,,they have greater insight of life,,,and apeears to very comitted with their love of music,,,,,,Rafi lovers,,,,gets so much in Rafi`s voice that their sole interest becomes rafisahab`s song,,,no matter how much they now want but they can never switch over to other singer from reaching rafi sahab,,its the last post of present days music,,,,,in ref 429 one of kishore fan admitted that his kishore kumar can hardly survive todays compitition in music industry(though he also added rafi sahab name),,,but ask todays numero uno,,Oscar winner of international level AR Rehman,,who says word extraordinary mean Mommad Rafi,,,he admittede while recording song of Legend of Bhagat singh and Guru saying,,that he uses many different singers because he don`t have one mohammad Rafi with him,,,,,,Rehman never given even a single song to kishore clones,,,,,however his fav is Sonu Nigham,Javed ali,sukhvindra Singh,udit narayana etc,,all inspired By Rafi sahab,,,and these singers is ruling singers of todays music industry who is reflection of Rafi sahab,,,
so,u can`t imagine what would have happened if sun itself would remain present!!!
Dear moderator, Sandeep Shrivastav here, ( i am writing my name as messages are being displayed in another names) request to pl. look into the matter, some technical problem.
What is happening. Post 446 is of mine and I have addressed it to kishore fan ji, but the name displayed is of kishore fan. Surprising.
Sandeep shrivastav
Kishore fan ji, – 444 (good number) – sandeep shrivastav (you have typed my name wrong in your message – as vasatav in 6th line) here & thanks for your clarification on your post 441
I was stating facts as I was associated with Mumbai for a sufficiently long period and I knew the environment. But I wish to clarify that I am a music lover and would like to state that rafi ji had a grand following in 60’s and he was numero one in that period, he was a shining jewel in those days. It was by sheer fortune kishore grew in popularity from 70’s. The impact which rafi had created is hard to measure , as I know that and moreover I specifically love many rafi songs my favourite number being yeh chand sa roshan chehra, from Kashmir ki kali, where rafi displays beautiful emotions and I am not sure whether kishore, if given chances in that period would have succeeded to the extent of impact created by rafi. But 70’s from aradhana, things changed for sure for kishore. I do not find the mesmerizing expressions displayed by rafi in Kashmir ki kali, in the songs bane chahe dushman or yaadon ki barat with kishore. Rafi just sang in a normal way in these songs. In others also like laila majnu etc. I do not find rafi that great as he was in 60’s. More importantly, the crowd developed liking for different musical compositions from 70’s for which by sheer fortune kishore suited for them. It was a pity that rafi did not regain his earlier grand status in 70’s, though he sang sufficient number of songs from mid-70’s (in early 70’s in some films rafi was only a background singer that too with one or two songs to say) Moreover, kishore fan ji, I do not specifically have any liking for kishore kumar ji, but I enjoy his songs from 70’s and earlier also (jewel thief etc.) I have great regard for rafi ji as well as kishore ji. I only wanted to mention some specific truths, which were prevalent in those days as many of the younger generation people these days do not have access to the great musical environment which we had in those days and which we enjoyed very very much (specially from 1950 to 1980) . And it was also one of the facts that after rafi passed away, hindi film world had lost its original charm. And after kishore passed away, whatever balance charm was left, was lost & there was nothing much to listen to hindi music. This is truth.
Coming to your other part of query, about shri ghantasala, I think it is not fair to compare a south Indian legend with hindi legendary singer, since the fields and nature of industry are different. However, since you have specifically addressed a question to me, I would like to express my opinion in only few lines. I heard Shri Ghantasala, he is really great & as you said in a different level altogether. I heard his songs posted in this site, he has got a god gifted divine voice with excellent control on his vocal chords, especially in shifting notes and amazing voice control on songs as well as music. I am sure, even rafi or other hindi singers would not have matched him or even had come close to him , if they were placed in the south Indian telugu industry. Similarly, I doubt if shri ghantasala was in hindi industry, whether he would have succeeded in making impact similar to the extent of impact which he made in his telugu industry. I think he would have done great in such case, but would have fallen short of his so called exalted status of “emperor of telugu playback singingâ€. I heard some similar compositions of rafi & shri ghantasala such as kuhu kuhu, chal ud ja re panchi etc. and in my opinion shri ghantasala was greater, rather I would say more impressive, in those numbers. However, based upon two songs, it is really very hard to judge and give opinion. However, In his semi classical and classical film numbers he appears unique & unmatched. Again, it is difficult to judge or compare him with hindi singers, as he was a carnatic specialist and hindi singers were hindusthani specialists. So it is really difficult to compare both. As I was given to understand, shri ghantasala has his own exalted place in music, which is difficult to surpass by anybody, similar to other great legends & which is greater in its own way.
Binu nair ji, 445
I will reply with immense respect towards you (even if you use undesirable words). It is a pity again, that rafi fans lose patience early. Your allegations will be corrected by yourself and you will feel sorry, after you read my current post addressed to kishore fan. I have no intention to argue, only I have placed facts which, in your heart of hearts, you know them as correct.
Thanks & regards to all.
Post 441 : Shrivastava:
you fooliiish kishore fan : u wish to prove Ki “shor” supremacy through the pages of mohd rafi website….
Its proving to be comical like the comic roles of Ki “shor”. we need comedians like you and u are welcome.
please do not stop and withdraw. please continue ur comical follies just as our beloved comedian kishore kumar .
binu nair
Post 442 sandeep shrivastav saab,
Post 441 is my post. I do not know how your name has cropped up. As you said, perhaps the messages are bouncing. I think we might have posted the messages at the same time or one another and might be some technical issue have cropped up. Hope the clarification is clear. I await your views for my post 441.
sandeepshrivastav ji it would`ve been better if individuality is not included in such talks,,as who r we,especially me,,a mere dust in front of these legends,,let only individuality of our beloved Rafi sahab remain inact in posts from my side,,,as if I concider u elder or u call me mother we would `nt be able to place our words,,,however as u have asked,,,in India it has been tradition to concider every unknown women to be represetation of Divine durga maa,,,,,if u follow such a conscience u call me mother,,,,,,but if u go literal,,,as u said in 70s u were in Mumbai,,,n I` was born in mid 80s,,,so through ur age u hold a respectfull place for me,,,but never through ur act of forcefully provoking we Rafi lovers to indulge in mindless discussion,being a Rafi lover n knowing what kind of person Rafi sahab was we respect all,,,but if provoked we can`t keep mum as it can give wrong impression to new readers ,,for heaven sake keep ur rock n roses aside or rather throw them out,,,,,lets enjoy the divinity called music,,,till today I had a thought that only arrogant young lad who know nothing about music,,keep on saying Jai guru jai guru on kishore forum,,they perhaps has forgotton what does the word guru means,,,do youth of India want such a guru who was hardly in good terms with anyone without any Viveka with 4 marriages and with no vairagya or renuciation having no money no work statement,,,,u may call its personal life,,,,,hence,we never bother about anyone`s personal life as all the celebrity of India or abroad r same because hardly anyone born with personality like that of Rafi sahab,(even kis kum revered his personality work n voice)hence we want a place where we can contemplate our mind for something beyond this materialistic and selfish world with divinity of rafi sahab`s voice but we r forced everytime to take part in debates this time its Kishore fans…….not just highly dedicated Binu sir,,or Nadkarni ji is respectable,I rafi sahab`s site everyone is respected, everyone is respectable, u r respectable as well as we all over here r blessed with interest in music,,,,and golden era music is in itself a bless n only blessed can understand that,,,,…..do u still think Sri nadkarni ji`s comment is irrelevent,do`nt u rather think that our whole discussion is irrelevent!!!
P.s. ref… in 404 kishorefan saying thanx to kishorefan (with added) ji of 401,,,,,…441 sandeep shirvastav saying thanx to sandeep shirvastav (with added ji & sir)of 439……….
Dear Moderator,
Post 441 is not my message. Is there any bouncing of messages here. The post is addressed to me, but the person who has posted has wrongly posted my name. Anyhow, I request the person who has posted the message to pl. clarify so that there is no confusion. Already, kishore lovers are being ridiculed and adding to this, this kind of bouncing of messages in duplicate names will act as fuel to the fire. I think the person might be either kishore fan or bapan ji, or lucky or others, do not know.
Sandeep shrivastav ji,
Thanks for your comments sir. Very few people are here who could actually understand our true intentions. Of course, this competition has been continuing since 1970. Saab, I too am a fair music lover with a trait for listening songs of all singers. But these kind of one sided views force us to put our views, otherwise we are silent music lovers. Shrivasatav ji, there has been another long debate in the true voice site, have you seen it (rafi & shri ghantasala – he too is unique and greatest from south indian playback singing with a thundering and velvet voice – in a way a mixture of rafi & kishore – he is classically very unique & in a different level altogether) There also the same fighting continued until ghantasala fans had to stop arguing like we kishore fans. Anyhow ghantasala fans can be stopped but kishore fans cannot be stopped, as things themselves prove for that.
Anonymous ji – 433, sorry I missed you in my earlier post.
True, what you have said. But as I have earlier said, the times do change and the 70’s was such that the times were different and naturally the compositions and music gems had undergone a change as compared to earlier legendary 50’s & 60’s period. You will appreciate that the 50’s & 60’s had too undergone a distinct change as compared to 30’s & 40’s . Hope you catch my point. Depending upon the times, the compositions were made and each singer had his time in those times such as saigal ji in 40’s, rafi ji in 50’s & 60’s & kishore in 70’s & mid 80’s etc. Each singer was best suited to their own times. I doubt if kishore would have suited for 40’s and saigal to 70’s. Similar with legendary rafi sahab and kishore. But here the problem is rafi fans quoting : all time best is rafi – here the dispute arises. This has no meaning. If rafi were the all time greatest and as someone puts in this site as rafi was all singers rolled into one (surprising funny comments) – well in such case rafi should have sung all the hindi films including of lata, asha etc. There should not be need for anyone else to sing. I sincerely doubt, Why other singers have become so much popular if rafi ji was so great and was capable of surpassing everbody (according to rafi fans) Well in such cases others need not sing.
Sabnavees ji – 430
Thanks for your comments and I too am in agreement with your views. You have caught my point. My respects to you as a true and secular rafi lover in this site. There should not be any problem if views of other rafi lovers are similar to yours. However, hardly this is the case.
Binu Nair ji – 437
I was in mumbai for many years in 70’s. It was a hardcore truth that the fan following of kishore kumar ji was immense in those days, even greater than rafi ji. This is , I say, again a hardcore truth. Rafi ji hardly was thought of by many people, clearly remember, in those days. The era was not of o p nayyar or naushad, it was a different scene, amitabh, pancham were the kings and in majority cases for these people, kishore was the preferred one. I lay my thoughts on the immense fan following of kishore kumar in those days. Days were such in early 70’s that when rajesh khanna car passed, the resultant dhool (sand) was taken in hands by many people, it was observed. These are not lies, binu nair ji. Even rafi did not have such following. I do not understand why you do not accept these facts and start digging lessons to kishore kumar fans. Fine, accepted – no kishore kumar lover has ever said rafi was not great, rafi was great in 50’s & 60’s , every one including kishore lover’s accept that. But why you people not accept the above hardcore truths. Binu ji, my earnest request is not to distort facts and pl. present them as they are. I repeat my earlier message, rafi was famous in 50’s & 60’s and kishore was popular in 70’s & mid 80’s. It is not a golden rule that rafi’s song are only great – indeed they are great. But it is a hardcore truth that rafi’s popularity was distincly and clearly enveloped by kishore in those days. I know 100% that even so called elder rafi fans here know this truth.
Savita ji, – 431
If you are much elder to me, i wish to address you as mother, if a little elder or younger then as a sister. Hope you might now know the respect we have for individuals. I am not shri binu nair, to call other people as having some disease or sandeep nadkarni ji, to comment on somebody’s parents (who are pujaniya elders) – Mr. nadkarni ji has not responded to my question – why he has passed comment on somebody’s parents when that was totally irrelevant. I am sure he will not have any answer. Would you agree for this savita ji. My sincere view is all the sane people will denounce such views, rather than supporting them. Shri binu nair & Nadkarni ji, as you claim, the respectable elders should set themselves as example for other writers here, otherwise reply will be rock for a rock only and rose for a rose only.
Ref post 429,
Sandeepshrivastavji,
Cannot agree to your line of thinking. Mohammed Ali is considered the greatest boxer of all times. You cannot start arguing whether he would have achieved the same greatness if he were fighting today.What this means is in whichever era he would have fought, he would have adapted to the style of that era and succeeded.
Similarly, Mohd Rafi is accepted as the greatest and best playback singer the Hindi film world has produced.We , the Rafi fans agree that Rafi came ahead of his times. He was instumental in introducing emotion and feeling into the Hindi film music. If he was born into a different era, he would still be the shining star in the horizon.
One last word. This a site for people who believe Rafi Saab is the last word in Hindi film playback singing. If you do nor subscibe to this ,please stay away.
Truth always bites – sometimes very hard. and hence their knee-jerk reactions which lacks conviction or facts from kishor fans.
kishore kumar fans wishes this site to talk about kishore kumar. they come in various names and disguises. this is a legal crime dear kk lovers and never ever forget it. be truthful in calling your names atleast.
they, also want this site to talk about their singer. please visit ur singers site and throw all the rubbish there – soonest. it’s mostly deserted and very few people visit there.
kishorefans, please understand three things in life.
1. mohd rafi lovers respects all good singers – without exception.
they respect all our music legends. but, we have our own music taste
which we will “never” alter to suit to hearing the hoarse and non-melodious
voice in “most” of the songs.
2. When elephants walk, the neighbour dogs bark.
3. there is no cure for ” jealousy ” so far. please understand this. and also
listen to the song : “jalti hai duniya, jalti rahe, sau sau rishte badalte
rahe, pyar ke gaadi chalti rahe, apni pyar ki gaadi chalti rahe.
mohd rafi is the real hero even after so many years of his leaving us.
Please see the cultural events of july and december each year. there are
maximum rafi musicals happening all around the globe. and mohd rafi
saaheb has the maximmum songs and fans – everywhere.
binu nair, mumbai….
Post 424 Bapan
You are using terms like voice modulation, heroism, zest, but your comment seems to be a big jest.
Are you serious? Ask any person who knows even a bit about music, chances are that you will be told that it would take at least 20 Kishore Kumars to make one Rafi Sahab, I am being conservative.
What do you mean, when you say more people know abt kk today. That is true, more people today know who is Katrina Kaif than those who know who is Meena Kumari, what does it mean, that Katrina is a better actor than MK? Your logic is beyond me.
See, kishore was a very good singer, better than many, but if you have to compare, then the ranking would be from 1 to 10 rafi sahab, then manna dey, mukesh, kk, shailendra singh, and others, I am not including singers of 30s and 40s like KL Saigal Sahab, atma ram sahab, because of the simple reason I have not heard them much and cannot (should not) judge. btw, the above ranking is not my creation, manna dey has put it on record, when asked to compare himself with others, he said, “I am better than kk, but rafi sahab is far better than anybody else, including me. If i have to rank, from 1 to 10 it would be rafi sahab, then myself, then mukesh, kk and others”. See the credentials of the person making that statement. Are you better qualified than Manna dey in music? I seriously doubt that.
Regards
troll,disease with no cure,,,and now final term perhaps the best term jager,,,mind modulation…..
Post 424: Again a rotten joke by this chap. Ki(shor)e Kumar had only shor in his songs, a hoarse voice. KK respected Rafi Saheb a lot.
Hi Sandeep Shrivastav,
You wrote: “famous during the 50’s & 60’s and the latter was more popular in 70’s and to mid 80’s”
kishore was a great singer. one of the biggest reasons why i prefer rafi is not only my subjective preferences but also because rafi sang compositions that i like better. i like music from the 50s, 60s, and up to 1975. after that point, there were still lots of gems but the consistency was lost. this criteria has little to do with singing ability or is even fair to kishore. i regret that. the other day i was listening to “Kuchh Hum Bhi Diwane” from naya andaz. how i wish kishore was given more compositions like this? he was a great singer but he was shortchanged that he wasn’t given enough great compositions to do his talent justice. i do believe that kishore had a talent for taking average compositions and taking them to the skies. he had that lively, charismatic voice & personality to do so.
Bapan
stop humiliating your self by such moronic comments. kishore kumar is not even worth comparing with Mahendra kapoor, let alone the badshah rafi.
He could not even sing his own songs, rafi has sung 11 times for him…voice modulation…..lol..lol , bewqakoof go and do your brain modulation before speaking such crap. I pity kishore kumar that he has such lump headed fools as fans. if it was not for the charity and politics of rd burman kishore kumar would be selling shoes in kandwa…
Lucky,,bapan,,two kishore fans,,sandipshirvastav,,,,and many more Ki–(shor) fans,,,,may be u all are one person using different pcs or ip adress or may be u all are different,,,,,,,but something sure is that u all are most irritating!
u `ve played wrong game now,,,the way commented on Sandeep Nadkarni ji and Binu Nair sir`s post,,,,,shows how low u can go,,,,,,what about elders!!! have u ever respected elders,,,don`t we know how much u hate them,while talking of Rafi sahab n rafi lovers,,,just even if for once any ane take Mr Nair`s name in Kishore forum how lunaticaly u all behave like start barking like wild dogs!!!
SandipShirvastava said ” in post 426 has cast a gloom on my great impression which I had for you “,,,,,,,u could not repect greatest Rafi sahab what could be expected about ur impression for Nandkarni ji,,u r tring to potrait false image of urs,,u never had any impression other than jeleousy,,,,why the hell,,,u all r here,,,,,did we bothered about Kis kum even for once,,,,u all of sudden come at once n start talking rubishh!~!!!
ref post — 429
sandeep shrivastav ji,
I fully agree with your views. At no point of time I have ever told that we have to measure music considering only the singers of our generation. then where do the stalwarts like k.l.sehgal sahab, pankaj mallik sahab, c.h.atma sahab, bade gulam ali sahab, raj kumari saheba, kishori amankar saheba stand ?
i always say this much very impartially that its purely the decission of the music directors to choose the singer for a particular song.
as far as the personal choice is concerned anil biswas sahab loved talat mehmood sahab immencely & was breaking down during the latters bed ridden time. legend salil choudhury sahab had a special liking for mukesh.the first choice of shankar- jaikishen was non other than rafi sahab. they even used rafi sahab as a playback for raj kapoor.
these are all the issues which are decided by the music directors & also by the era where there is a change in generation & its taste. its the taste of the generation.
my father used to like sehegal sahab, i worship rafi sahab & to my dismay my son also is a great fan of rafi sahab. he exclaims ‘ appa rafi sahab is so sweet ‘ ( in my mother tongue ‘ appa ‘ means ‘ father ‘.)
sir these liking & disliking are the relative terms. some body likes a rose, some one likes a jasmin & some one likes the smell of cowdung. its their individual taste. let them enjoy or go to hell, why should we fight when life is short & we are almost in the evening of it.
It would certainly be appreciated that if rafi ji is called a role model singer for others, rather than landing in comparisons of who is great and likewise. It is not really easy for us to understand the talents of those great artists as layman individuals. Can people sing songs like those artists. People cannot do that but they are ready to pass comments against those artists. What a pity situation many people are into in this site.
Sabnavees ji,
Agreed on your line of argument. But it has to be remembered that things change according to time. The depth of songs was different in 50’s and 60’s as compared to 70’s & 80’s. The variety undergoes change according to time and accordingly, the songs which were prevailing in 70’s & 80’s were according to those times. Today, there is a total change. Keeping in current trends, I do not thing even mohd. rafi or kishore kumar or mukest or mannada would have survived the competition today, if they were there. They were best suited for those times and they have excelled in that. You know in the south spb, once a popular singer what he is today – competition. Same would have happened to hindi ones as well.
contd… Sandeep nadkarni ji,
Further, you would have replied to kishore fan ji, what was necessity to bring his parents (respectable elders) into question. This is a total deviation from the topic. I think this cannot be appreciated at all.
Both rafi and kishore were great singers in hindi film world. The former was more famous during the 50’s & 60’s and the latter was more popular in 70’s and to mid 80’s. So each had their unique contribution to hindi films and with a mass fan following for both of them. It is not correct to project one as superior and other as inferior. Further, not only these two, many other singers such as manna dey, mukesh also had their stamps. Manna dey had a classical edge, mukest had a talent which was rare to achieve by many. Mukesh used to sing the entire song in a straight way without twisting notes in the entire song, this was one of the special talent which many singers did not possess. Lata ji was a great singer in her own right who never has been surpassed. So there are many other talented artists too and it will not be correct to simply project one singer as the greatest than other.
There is no offence in kishore fan ji’s message here, I do not know why such fuss is being created here, for tackling one kishore fan, so many so called rafi fans are forced to reply.
Next, What I could view from the messages in this site is : kishore lovers and fans of other singers have lot of patience, they do not use any wrong words towards rafi fans. Kishore fan ji had been very dignified in his messages but here binu nair, who is the leader of rafi foundation, and also another music exponent sandeep nadkarni ji (my respects for his music talent) are using wrong words against other individuals. It would be better, if they do not have the requisite patience to argue in a dignified way, to stop making comments against others. Better to remember the proverb : for a mad man others also look like a mad man. Similarly, macchar ko sab macchar dikthe hai.
Sandeep Nadkarni ji,
I know you as a musical talent. But honestly speaking, your message in post 426 has cast a gloom on my great impression which I had for you for your past messages in this rafi forum. You yourself being a talent, can you accept if somebody says kishore is not a singer or mukesh is not a singer or manna is not, specifically at the cost of calling rafi only a singer.
I fully agree with Mr Binujee in his post 423 to leave this machhar Kishorefan alone mainly because I very much doubt shayad unke parents ne paida hote hee unka naam shayad nahee rakha tha and probably this is the reason why he calls himself as Kishorefan.
Apne naam ke saat likho dost agar naam nahee hai tho hum tumhe ek accha sa naam denge warna tab tak tumhe machhar ke naam se hee pukarenge.
Kishorefan pehle chullu bhar panee mein apna mooh dokhe aawo aur phir Rafi Saab ka naam pyaar se pukaro.
Kuch samajhe ye aur thoda samjhane kee zaroorat hai.
It was a coincidence that abt a month back I heard for the first time, “Tere Pyar ne mujhe gham diya” yeah, I was amazed, but let me first tell you that I used to think I have heard all of ’em by Rafi Sahab, I have been almost an obsessed fan of his ever since I was, let us say for the past twenty years, and here i was, listening to another of his gems for the first time, the feeling was out of this world, the serene voice, effortlessly changing pitch, still remaining the same, wow, there are few instances in life when you feel in such a way, maybe when you realise you are in love, or when you feel very close to our supreme maker, it is blissful, “Kahin aur chal mere dil yahan kabhi laut kar nahin ayenge” words are not powerful enough to express the emotions one goes through.
Anyway, I heard this song, got mesmerised, googled it and found this site, a very pleasant surprise indeed, been reading this site since then, maybe last three weeks. Felt hurt at times by some comments, actually the reason i am typing this.
See, my point is very simple, singers like Kishore, Sonu, and others are very good, that is why they have reached where they have in the first place, but comparing others with Rafi and God forbid, trying to tell people that they were better is nothing less than sacrilege, for me, Rafi Sahab has been the best playback singer by a long long way, others like Manna Dey, Mukesh, KK come next but their ranking starts at quite some distance from the top.
At the same time, I wonder, why these people say so? The only explanation I can think of is that they have not really, actually heard Rafi Sahab. It is my humble request to such friends to go through the experience, with an open mind, and then come back and post your comments. This very site has so many priceless gems of his listed which if you hear once, you cannot help being a Rafi bhakt as I am.
For instance, listen to the one I wrote about above, It is very difficult to think of another singer who could have rendered it almost half as good.
Kishoreda is a better singer than Rafi due to his voice modulation,heroism and playback ability.He had a zest in his voice.He was also an allrounder.Also Kishoreda is the most popular artist of present times,many people of todays generation do not know who is Rafi but everyone knows about Kishore Kumar.So I think the points raised by Kishorefan are valid.
dear friends: the bug called kishorefan is afflicted with a disease that has no known cure.
please leave him alone.
i wish to tell him : when elephants strolls, the neighbourhood dog’s bark. leave him alone, please do not care for the dog bark.
enjoy the music – folks.
binu nair
when kishore kumat himself accepted with grace that Rafi was a much better singer than him and could sing a song i many ways compared to KK who could sing only in one straight manner then why are these so called kishore fans fuming and getting into these ludicrous dicussuions.
i apologize for my mistake, i meant to say music “lovers” and not “directors” in the 4th line from the bottom. i also think that this concert did not show the best of sonu’s abilities or his best approach. these things happen when you try something new (especially LIVE!). plus, there was greater burden on these songs for sonu. rafi sahab had already sang them to perfection that there wasn’t much to improve. furthermore, he gave a great demonstration of singing the songs with great expression & depth (that the intricate, genius compositions of MDs from rafi’s time demanded). the singer would have do all that (which is near impossible, rafi was a supreme talent) AND sound different. so many constraints to handle! this many constraints could make it very confusing for a new singer to try to work with. he doesn’t have this issue when he sings a composition as the original singer.
i too believe rafi was the greatest but i won’t use “ajab hai dastaan” to prove it. kishore did not have rafi’s range but it was very competent. he was rarely limited to sing a song in his career because of scale. i won’t speculate whether kishore could sing “ajab hai dastan” because he never attempted it and i’ll give him the benefit of the doubt based on my positive assessment of his range. it’s true that sj are musical geniuses but their decision to have rafi sing it was not based purely on music. it was opinion and subjective preference for rafi. for them, rafi was a sure thing, and easy ace, so they opted for him in the song. sj choosing rafi for that song is more indication of sj’s confidence & great rapport with rafi then for kishore’s singing ability.
rafi has too many gems & accomplishments in his career (and a supreme voice & expression of emotions) that are greater proof and great subjects of focus for his timeless legacy and zenith position in music. the ~20 songs he sang for kishore are nice but not indicators like the previous credentials or a song like “yeh mera prem patra”. while rafi sang wonderfully for the 20 songs i am confident that the mds didn’t get rafi for those because the songs were out of kishore’s abilities. there’s nothing in “hame koi gham hai” or “apni adat” that kishore has not proven he can handle. the only song i could think of would be “man mawra bawra” but speaking for myself, classical music is not my favorite genre so i’m not too concerned with it. i can understand some doubt on one more song – ajab hai dastaan itself – but my opinion still stands. so that’s a total of 2 / 20 songs. i wouldn’t use rafi singing for kishore to make comparisons but maybe to point out the great respect & chemistry both artists shared.
but alas, we rafi fans & music lovers have more intersting topics to discuss. why waste our time in repetitive, boring comparisons? even in this post, i have tried to avoid comparison but comment on the singers with respect to themselves. we should focus more on the great songs of mohammed rafi and enlighten ourselves with more hidden gems (which is the journey i am currently undertaking).
in an attempt to steer this thread back to topic :P, i will make a few comments on sonu nigam. first, put aside any comparisons for sonu & rafi. rafi is incomparable. furthermore, both are artists with unique voices and i like having different voices as it adds color to the spectrum. rafi’s voice is gold yes, but if my entire room were made of gold, call me nuts, i would ask for sliver, bronze, and wood materials in the room too. i would want variety. so let’s set aside comparisions.
there are some songs of sonu that i really like. songs from border, deewana mastana (hungama ho gaya i think?), kriish, and even parineeta. notice he sounds more comfortable and natural while expressing emotions in the songs. if they don’t sound quite as natural as rafi or kishore let’s put that aside. just because you’re not a million miles high (rafi or kishore) does not mean that you can’t be 500,000 miles high. sonu still does a good job. so why is that he is so comfortable & natural in his own songs but then does not perform the same for this concert? notice, even the cover versions of rafi songs by sonu nigam sound closer to natural and better emoted (as pointed out by fans before). i don’t think it’s a matter of ability but i think sonu made an artistic judgment that did not quite connect with fans. for this concert, he tried to take a different approach from his usual self or even what rafi sahab provided us, for the sake of variety. this approach didn’t click with the audience. he tried to put so much emotion in this song but ignored his judgment in properly placing the harkats and taans (as he has done reasonably well in his own songs and cover versions before). so all i can say is that nice try sonu, thank you for your efforts, it’s unfortuntate that rafi sahab is not with us here today, but we are still grateful you were around give whatever tribute you could. i like udit narayan but he is not very comfortable when singing live so sonu was not a bad choice.
i would not want to categorize sonu as purely a rafi clone. no question he was inspired by rafi sahab (as thousands of singers are) but he does have a different voice. the singer that sang “piya bole” sounded very different from rafi sahab (nevermind who would sound better – the point is that they are very different in the voice itself). in this sense, i give sonu points for some originality in him finding his voice. i give him points for his consistency and for his efforts. anwar & shabbir kumar were pure subsets of rafi sahab and they both went off key quite a bit. i would say neither for sonu. i think sonu nigam is the best singer to date that is has been inspired from mohammed rafi. this is no reflection on rafi sahab’s own, heavenly singing ability but i guess it is proud legacy that the legend continues to inspire thousands of upcoming singers and millions of music directors. i suppose we could include udit narayan’s name with sonu on my favorite / most regarded singers inspired by rafi sahab but sometimes people say udit’s voice is very original (which it is).
Post 414: Ki(shor)efan – i PADO RASTE. No one needs you here.
Kkishorefan,
ref post 414,
sir I appreciate your love & respect for music. your appreciation to both rafi sahab & kishore ji. I agree both are the most beautiful singers. but when the question of range, melody comes there it matters.
i dont know how much you know about the ‘ scale ‘ in music. i will give you an example . the song ‘ ajab hai dastan teri ye zindagi ‘ from shararat was sung by rafi sahab where as kishore ji was the hero of the film & he himself is a playback singer of repute. but shankar – jaikishen had decided that rafi sahab to sing the song. it was because kishore ji cant attain that melody in the antara of the song where it reaches the maximum pitch. to come to kishore jis vocal chords the scale has to be reduced & by doing that the melody is lost. there lises the magic. like this rafi sahab has sung 11 songs for kishore ji. but its the greatness of kishore ji to accept.
now coming to ‘ yodelling ‘ rafi sahab has sung one song for firoz khan in a black & white movie where there is tremendous yodelling. its much more above that of kishore ji. do you know that ?
the way rafi sahab sings those ‘ madhosh ‘ numbers kishore ji cant attain that perfection. again its the vocal chords.
remember that song ‘ dilruba, dilpe to, ye sitam kiyeja’ from rajkumar the way rafi sahab attained the highest pitch with a typical voice in the second antara when he sings ‘ ham bhi to aag mein jaltey rahey, pyar ke sholon pe chaltey rahey ‘ i doubt kishore ji could ever have done like that. only he can give a deviation for a single note & not for multiple notes like this.
now please try to understand that rafi sahab can be kishore ji but kishore ji can never be rafi sahab. the vocal chords are like that which have been designed by the almighty.
and now coming to the aspect of religion i myself is a ‘ madhwa brahmin ‘. i do sandhya vandan religiously, this is termed as ‘ namaz ‘ by muslims & as ‘ prayer ‘ by Christians. but when the question of ‘ music ‘ comes its all one religion i believe. i see ‘ god ‘ in music.
in this forum we dont critisize or let down any one. we discuss about the beauty of music & the beauty of the artists who adds melody to it. when we listen to a melodious number our heart id filled with immence joy & we call its a day.
Kis fan Ji,,namaste Again…u urself said(perhaps sarcastically) that everyone is great in their own way and should be respected for their individuality,,100% agree with u,,trust me that everyone over here do respect other singers as well but Rafi sahab has very special place,,,,,but what about u,,,don`t u know the title of this article,,its about Sonu Nigam`s tribute to rafi sahab, but u forget Sonu`s name,when writing HFM,,,mentioned from shehgal till kumar sanu,,,,kumar sanu who sings in Kis kum`s style and whos career collasped 10 years back after so many hits,,,,,but u didn`t mentioned name of todays,,,,Sonu Nigham,,Udit anrayan,,sukhwindra singh,, javed ali,.,,,as they r all inspired by rafi sahab!!
P>S Plz post reply on true voice -Mohd Rafi,,,,,as its really useless and time wasting to prove anyone that how great rafi sahab was,,,,its like dictating the frog of well, that how big an ocean is!!!!
KishoreFan ji,Humblest namaste by this side!,,,let me add by myself that my knowledge of religion is nothing I`m most ignorant among all of u I`m like a dot of salt in comparision with endless ocean of Religion,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,but now u tell me and everyone over here that who has given u and ur friends authority to be an angel by urself that u r here to ” stop hatred” and that we all are wild animal here who hates everyone,,from were u came to preach ourselves!!!
U don`t know anything about either our approch or about Rafi sahab,,,but by reading a few posts starts making judgment over ouselves!Mind u,,,,more than reading about rafi sahab we have realized him and his divinity but u who come to critisize can never realize that!….Its tyranny of this nation because of few critics that they don`t recognise such a divine person like rafi sahab in such glamour materialistic world where one side one person is dieing for royalty and other says no money no work,,,,Rafi sahab rather by his personality showed the world that even in such a world of pomp n show one can live such a simnple,kind and divine Life with best of talent dedicated to god!and about singing,,whole world jealus him,,and ploted against him,,,history is the proof,,,but rafi sahab excelled every Raaga and stream of singing,,,as if its nothing to do with him,,its God`s work and he is just the medium,,so never bothered what people r saying,either praise or curse,what kind of music is,,,,he just work hardest to give best,,,,,Best that is divinity itself,,,hence,even on material frame as well,,,he retained the top slot of music chart…,
And ur krishna story,,,,I don`t know what was done with Meera bai since as far as I`m concerned I was not present over there but I can feel the immence bhakti of Meera Bai`s songs,a true love,,the whole format of India classical is indebted to her songs !Indian religion is Realization”,Veda says,””unless u see urself there is no god so renounce world,scrripture,stories n realize god in anyone n anything whatsoever”!and what do u mean by true divotion only towards god,,isn`t acc to ur veda, vedanta & purana that God is everywhere,,,n there is nothing as such any specific God,,isn`t the same Krishna Told arjuna,,that ” I`m u n u r me”””,,”,everything is me” ,and “”anyone who`s being worshipped no matter even if a stone is worshipped or may be through wrong way know it for sure I`m being worshipped””,,and also,””if u see anyone endowed extraordinarily graced with fine arts and humblest personality know for sure this grace to be divinity””” n “”music is something that connects a pesron to God more easily than anyother art””””, and
,,why meera only,,,If we r alive today,its because of God`s grace as we live so close to death”,,I call this divine bequest as christ u call Krishna,,,,,,”
and about if rafi sahab could sing kishore song,,why sould he sing like other ,as he can sing better,,,,don`t u know,,,It was kishore kumar himself who slapped a person who echoed ur word and kis kum stated that if Kis kum himself can sing in one way,rafi shab could sing the same song in many ways!!!!strange,,even today they ask same question,sory no kis kum to slap them now,,,this shows kis kum`s fan`s understanding of Kis kum as well, after even slap,,they don`t understand…..and keep on shouting,,,,
One need not rely upon comments of any biased rafi fans. Here is latest interview published by rediff with Kumar sanu. The link can be typed in URL for opening it. He clearly says pancham da is the best. Further he says, that Aashiqui is the only film in which all songs are hits as compared to any film before or after 30 years of Aashiqui.
ia.rediff.com/movies/slide-show/2009/jun/17/slide-show-1-bringing-back-kumar-sanu.htm
He says pancham da is the best who brought the real talent of kishore da into light. Fine, kumar sanu ji, praises both rafi and kishore da equally in his interview.
Savita ji, – namaste
I do not know about your knowledge on religion. No body has made communal statements, in fact I grasp from MR. kishore fans messages and Mr. Lucky messages that a earnest request to stop spreading hatred towards other singers. Where is communal here.
Your other comment on Sri Krishna – Do you know Sri Krishna indeed came to rescue of Mira bai always such as when she was given poision by in laws, she was driven towards suicide in river etc. Similarly, people who prayed with true devotion to christ were protected. These are not miracles : if you call them miracles it is ignorant knowledge. That is true devotion to almighty god who protects his devotees. Remember, People who have true devotion towards god are always protected and further remember he can be protected only for sure, if has true devotion and only towards god. If you have devotion other than god towards anybody else – no guarantee whether you can be protected or not. Do not take this as communal message rather I wanted to correct you notions of spiritual aspects which cannot be understood by ordinary human beings.
Coming back to rafi ji, no body disputes his greatness. Singer like him in playback singing is difficult to find and influence cast by rafi is immense in playback singing in singing various types of genres.
That does not mean other singers are less. Kishore cannot sing like rafi good then can rafi sing like kishore – cannot my dear. What I mean is each individual has their own speciality and they should be respected for that own specialities. HFM has produced many greats right from saigal to kumar sanu and each have their own say in their area of singing – right with rafi’s popularity is more than others.
आज à¤à¥€ जिंदा है रफी
Among the many verses written in praise of Rafi Sahab by eminent poets over the last several decades, here is one by Qamar Jalalabadi, which conveys an entire meaning to what Music is and how Rafi Sahab was the complete embodiment of Music. This is how it goes……..
देश के लाखों जवानों की तमनà¥à¤¨à¤¾ है रफी,
ज़खà¥à¤®-इ-दिल के लिठखà¥à¤µà¤¾à¤¬à¥‹à¤‚ का मसीहा है रफी,
इसके नगमों ने जगाये हैं हजारों जज़à¥à¤¬à¤¾à¤¤,
सिरà¥à¤« नगमा नहीं, नगà¥à¤®à¤¾à¤¤ की दà¥à¤¨à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ है रफी,
इसके गीतों के है दीवाने ज़माने में सà¤à¥€,
जितने फनकार हैं इन सबमे में अनोखा है रफी,
मैंने पूछा के कलाकार हमारा है कहाà¤,
इसके नगमों ने कहा “आज à¤à¥€ जिंदा हैं रफी”.
Eminent poets have said it all. Naushad has written several lovely couplets (sheyrs) on Rafi Sahab and other ace music directors have paid rich tributes to Rafi Sahab and his uniqueness in song rendition. Then who are we to butt in every now and then with our half baked views on music. Let us just listen to the divine music of Rafi Sahab and forget what any one else says. A few people cannot change the tide and history will always remind them and future generations that Rafi Sahab was indeed a gift of the gods to humanity.
Post 404: This is expected with kishore fans only, they have to learn manners which they don’t have.
critics reached eternal rafi dot com as well,,,,how disturbed there mind is,,,,when I say disturbed I know its not expected from a fan of saintly Rafi sahab,,,however!!!! I ask directly to Lucky and two clones kishorefans,,,,,,,,,,,u have said tooo much over here! something that can be summarised noise,,jealusy,,ctisizm,,,and strange preaching hate as well,,and with ur words of personal god its an attepmt to disturb communal harmony here,,,,being christain I know how sensative such terms are in India,,,but mind u all ,,,”””””Rafi sahab is greatest for his personality”””””””,,,see how his persnality is beyond mere entertainment,,,people of all religion gathers here and wonders divotion of this Man,,,,hindus can`t stop `emselves listening song of this finest of Human being on their religious festival,,like badi der bhai nandlala,,,govinda ala re etc,,, on Krishnastmi,,naam re sabse bada tera naam,,ambe tu hai jagdambe kali,etc on durga puja,,,Ramji ki nikli sawari,,jai Raghunandan jai siya raam,,,etc on diwali,Ramnavi or Vijya dashmi,,,man rang lo ji tan Rang lo,,etc Holi,,Ganpati bappa maurya etc on,,well well, list goes count less there have been so many religious song relesed every day why then Rafi sahab`s religious song is still among most played,,,call it shirdi waale sai baab,or sai baba bolo,,,or Ramkrishna hari gopal krishna hari,,,,,,but on islam side also,,,,when he had to sing bhajan he used to pray allah in studio as well to grant him courage to retain bhakti,,,who can forget Allah mere alah,,Mohmmad ka nakshe kadam choom lunga etc,,,,,and punjabi or banldeshi songs are also very popular,,,,,but if anyone want to forget relligion for a moment,,,come to Desh bhakti number,,,every year,,on republic day and independense day only rafi song is played most with other singers,,,,Many sings many song but impact is missing,,,,And rafi shab has a impact because of which he is called greatest that even one song by him is greater than thoushand songs of other singer,,,,Thats why rafi sahab is greatest! ,,,,,,and in main stream,western,rock, melody,romantic, happy,funny,gazals,,,qawallis and sad numbers etcs are beyond this worlds range,,hence called divine range………………forget personality (because u can`t grasp that),only concentrate on singing side if any of u find even a single singer on this planet or other planet who is so much versatile of that much variety,,,,and most importantly with that much “impact” like that of Rafi sahab!,over even distant close to that,,let us know,,,and we will stop and listen to ur stupid words but till than,,, as u got chance and came here,,,drink this divine nector in rafi sahab`s voice or live the life of crab!!!
,,,why didn`t u have anything in praise of the ideal of ur choice,,,even person with nick kishore didn`t say even a single word for kishore kumar rather both worked here to critisize us or Rafi sahab,,,,,,it dicribe nothing but sickness!!! ask urself,,,,u didn`t say what so great about ur choice and why would u jelous about our respect for Rafi sahab,,,,let me add we very smaller samaller than an ant in comparision to Rafi sahab,,who is for us our universe,,our words to praise Rafi sahab is nothing in compare to Rafi sahab taaan thats greater than sky,,,yet we try ourselves to give homage to our beloved Rafi sahab,,that too people like u can`t digest,,here on other similar sites for rafi sahab,,,,just think if u can`t digest our voice,,,and keep on vomiting here n there,,what would happen to you and likes of u,,when u`ll hear Mohd Rafi sahab`s Divine voice,,,,,,,only God can save!!!!!!
Lucky & Kishorefan : So sorry that – medically yet, there has been no medicine invented or discovered for “Jealousy”. if it were, then both of you would never have come in to this site of mohd rafi lovers and spoken about your abnormal behavioural patterns as uninvited guests. ( i will not call you flies ).
please , please, enjoy your music and your singers. and let us enjoy ours. propriety “urgently” demands that both – shut up now and here and shift out of this site. that’s if you know what propriety is.
binu nair
Lucky
how about i prouduce hate mails of fans of other singers against Rafisaab and his fans. Every time Rafisaab is brought into discussions of comparison by others, why not people dsiscuss whether KK was greater than Mukesh or vice versa or Mana Dey or some other singer was greater than the other. The common factor is always Rafisaab as the fact is that he is the benchmark, the very best. People are just jealous or have got an inferiority complex self imposed by themselves as they dont consider themselves Rafisaab fans. One cannot be a true lover of HFM without being a fan Of Rafisaab.
The issue is not the fan club but the singer dude. If you feel Rafisaab is not the greatest then good look luck to you but stop playing an appologist for anti Rafi club. Seriously with all due respects we dont require hypocrites telling us what to do.
You know what there may be a few naive people who call them Rafians and degrade other singers but they only get istigated by bigots on the other side. Guess what !!as a Rafian I find myself in a elite position that I dont have to degrade any singer to prove the untmatched greateness of Rafisaab. Its like trying to downgrade Phil Nickelson or other golfer when one is a fan of the greatest golfer ever, Tiger woods, simply senseless. I am sure now you will say that Tiger Woods is not the greatest. golfer..LOL
Edit typo: asha bhonsle’s musical talent & achievments are legendary but i will ***not*** blindly accept all her personal actions as appropriate.
hello kishorefan,
i like to view issues positively too, especially when it is relevant to the saintly mohammed rafi. however, i must call a spade a spade. asha bhonsle’s musical talent & achievments are legendary but i will blindly accept all her personal actions as appropriate.
asha bhonsle’s superiority over a mortal like me is limited only to singing ability or experiences within the music industry. it does not mean that she is a higher *human being*. we are all blessed equally with the gift of life.
as a music lover and human being, i have an obligation to speak out when someone unjustly discredits mohammed rafi. this is for the sake of young music lovers today who deserve a complete and truthful view. a great example of this responsibility is mr. haldar’s open letter to raju bharatan on rock n roll. i appreciated rafi sahab even more after hearing songs i had not heard before. had i fell victim to mr. bhartan’s motives, i would have been a deprived of gems.
i agree that all the legends were great in their own way. each was unique, inimitable, and indispensible. however, some were clearly more versatile and capable than others but this does not take away from the inimitable magic of a particular legend.
“When hfm list of greats is counted asha bhonsle has equal place along with mohd. rafi”
i’ll say that asha is great singer of hfm like rafi. i won’t be as specific to say “equal” but that’s not something i care to contend. rafi had a very positive impact in the industry not only musically but as a great human being who supported his fellow singers, mds, musicians, actors, etc.
Fictitious kishore fan : Please do not advise mohd rafi fans.
i would say rather take some advice from some good doctors at the earliest. i will help you our in mumbai or anywhere else. please do not worry. u will be allright soonest.
by the way a small requst : please do not spoil the fan of kishore kumar saaheb by holding to his bandwagon or his name.
kishore fan(sory gain to kishore kumar for having such fans!)and about universal acceptance,,,,,,this can never happen,,,because if on these earth God beloved like Hussen,Chrisht,Budha,rama krishna get birth and at the same time burderned the earth Yazid1,Rabbi,Ravana,kansa,,,,,,everyone had their followers,,,so never in history anyone has seen univarsal accptence of anyone,,,,,,,But rafi sahab stands on different platform never did he,,and nor did we claim or would ever claim that he is God or any stupid illiterate rumer,,,,,,,but we r firm on our thought that in every raaga of Rafi sahab it appears that he is doing Ibadat,,,,,,his divotion for singing is extremly beyond normal person`s understanding,like that of a farista,,,when he sings,tune mujhe bulaya sherawaliye ” ankhiyan hari darshan ki pyasi”,,listener can feel the virah of truly divine being,,,and when he sings,,,prwar digar alam and har ek sheh se badhkad,hai jannat se badhkad madione ki galian,,,,anyone`s heart die out to go to madine ki galian`,not only voice but in personal life also he mentained his integrity with divinity and live life with greatest heart,,,what a divine voice,,how egoless or ego dedicated to god,,,,,we r compllled to think that he is blessed with divinity,,,,,,,however there can never be “””” universal acceptance””””,,,people are so much crafted with meterialism,,,and so much orthodox that never can everyone understand person like rafi sahab,,,,,,,but always there will be person to critisize,,,,,but no matter how much darkness is only one candle can light the whole room and intensity of light depends on our distance from the source of light……May Christ grant u and likes of u wisdom that u can appriciate other as well!,,,,,
Rafians
The messages are going off the track. It is a pity to see that many messages contain the negative comments by yesteryear celebrities against rafi ji. and moreso rafi fans themselves are bringing out such points. This is only going to bring out the negative aspects which prevailed in those days against rafi ji. Why can’t dear rafi fans post only positive comments by celebrities on rafi ji. This will enable them to project rafi ji in a better way and also save them from the sin of passing wrong comments on other singers or artists and also will act as deterrence to fans of other singers from passing any undesirable comments or making arguments.
Post 401 by kishore fan ji stands interesting : I appreciate his frank views & no offense. I specifically liked one point in his message i.e find virtues in others rather than finding faults – good message and that should be the case here also.
Folks,
Don’t jump on me, I have never said anything against Rafi, he was a great singer and a nice human being indeed, but not the greatest as far as i am concerned, in playback singing we have many greats like Lata, Sehgal, Rafi, Talat, Hemant etc. and in non filmi we had Bade gulam ali khan sahab, Aamir Khan Saahib and many other greats. but dear rafi fans, stop spreading hatred here and there for other singers, i have never seen other than rafi fans doing such things, go through this for an instance, what a trash, a perfect example of hatred:
http://www.eternalrafi.com/home/index.php/Fans-Talk/Lata-Rafi-Duet-or-Duel.html#maxcomment2178
i can cite many such examples where rafi fans are writing trash for others,primarily for Lata,kishore and Asha, kindly refrain such things, be a gentlemen like Rafi Sahib.
Mr or miss kishorefan,,ur presence is here like Jatila and ur brother or sister lucky is rather kutila,,,well jatila kutila were the women, in fact,in-laws of Srimati Radha rani,,,,they could never grasp Srimati Radha ji`s love for Bhagwan Krishna(often addressed in India as Purna-complete avtara with the mixture of Nitya and lila both).Jatila kutila used to use harsh word for Krishna similarly like u,,and used to say Rani Radha,,,, “if u will be tortured let us see if ur krishna comes to save u”””,,there word is similar to that what u said that if we get heart attack let us see rafi sahab comes to save us,,,anyway,,,to their remarks,,,,,Radha ji `s used to laugh inside that they don`t know what they are saying,,,,same happened with Jesus crisht,,when Christ was to crucified some Jews asked christ if u r God then let us show some magic and free urself,,,christ once laughed inside & said loudly,,god forgive `em they don`t know what they r saying,,,,,,I`m no way going to say that I want u and likes of u to see rafi sahab as christ,,as I suspect even if u see christ as god or not,,,because it appears that ur understanding of religion is mere miracle worship,,,u can u worship magician but not God of feeling,,
PS. and for God sake stop using name of saits ,,like nanak,,swami or sai baba,,,,,if u have ur own authority talk or leave this place rather than using any communal topic to disturb this forum`s environment!,
Dear rafi lovers,
I request all the dearest rafi lovers to kindly give a patient reading to my post herein.
I again say, in continuance to my previous post, why irrelevant comments are being passed against singers. Now it is asha bhonsle. My earlier post has also evoked a strong reaction when I have requested the music lovers to be open minded. Rafi ji never had bad word for anyone, but what about these so called fans who are passing some undesirable comments. In all my posts, I had admired rafi ji with equal respect all other greats whoever may be the likes being kk, lata, asha or others including from the south ghantasala ji etc. but we never say anything against rafi ji. When rafi ji sings well, we say he sings well. When others sing well, we too say the same but we never say that this is the only singer who on earth can sing well. We just appreciate those music talents as somebody says here if the music appeals, the heart will naturally sing for whoever sings it. Friends, please try to be open minded. Every human being has his own goods and bads. But on the spiritual side, great people have advised us to count only the virtues and not to look at faults. This is the quality of a great human being.
Among the music greats, asha bhonsle has a place of her own in hfm and nobody can dispute that. Mr Lucky is correct when he says this and please do not think that I am a supporter of Mr. lucky. I just endorse correct & frank views, which I think as correct. When hfm list of greats is counted asha bhonsle has equal place along with mohd. rafi ji. True, many say rafi ji is greatest, similarly many also say rafi ji is not greatest (we have seen in many debates), and in similar lines, many fans of diffferent singers viz., kishore kumar they say kishore ji is greatest, ghantasala fans say he is the greatest singer ever born, manna dey singers say he is great in hindi, and lata fans say she is the greatest and so on, and these fans, truly saying never acknowledge rafi ji to be greater than their idols. Indeed true. But at the same time I have seen, as Mr. Lucky also says, that they never degrade rafi ji in any way. As Mr. lucky says, appreciate others as well, though you may love your idol, that is a different issue. It is not necessary that as you love your idol, he should be loved by all. No chance by any means.
To be purely open and frank, as some rafi fans herein say that rafi ji is referred to as greatest by all & universal is not correct, as my above post clearly brings out the facts on the issue. Friends, Universal acceptance of an individual means he is loved equally by all even enemies and critics. Guru Raghavendra swamy, Guru Nanak etc. are admired by people of all races irrespective of caste, creed & religion, even enemies and critics and they have universal love towards every body. Shirdi sai baba is even loved by animals as his story says that is universal love towards creatures. They are therefore worshipped as God. Mohd. rafi ji (as some rafi fans claim here) should be put in correct perspective as a human being and as I requested in my previous post, not to write some superficial comments such as demigod etc. as same comments will be continued to be passed by fans of other singers as well. Rafi fans will themselves set an example for making other singers too as demigods for their respective fans and again same thing will follow : praising their own singers with comparison to rafi. And as some doctor ji in these posts was mentioning earlier, (I endorse those frank views) please do not try to raise blood pressure, if any heart attack comes mohd rafi cannot save you even if you call him as god or demigod (only guru raghavendra swamy can save you if you worship him)
By the way, I am completely cool and calm while writing this post in this good site of rafi ji (By the grace of Guru Raghavendra Swamy ji).
I hope all music lovers will take my post in true spirit and be open minded with frank and truthful in their discussions.
Dear Mr. Anonymous
Thank you for your support. You have correctly understood my message and my deep respects for your views therein.