Did R.D.Burman really preferred KK over Rafi?
This article is written by Mr.H.V.Guru Murthy.
A regular browser to web site mohdrafi.com, having gone through the letters of Rafi lovers would assume that R D Burman did not utilize Rafi properly, instead he preferred Kishore Kumar. Because of this reason, Rafi Fans are still upset with RDB even though he passed away a decade back.
Yes, it is true that RDB preferred KK over Rafi during early seventies. For that matter, which Music Director or Actor or Producer or Director will not have his preference. It was well known that Raj Kapoor always preferred Mukesh, Manoj Kumar preferred Mukesh or Mahendra Kapoor, B.R.Chopra films had Mahendra, MD Ravi also had plenty of songs with Mahendra so also O.P after he broke with Rafi. Similarly OP always had either Asha or Geetha Dutt and never Lata. Salil also used all other Singers. Director Subba Rao insisted on Mukesh for SAATHI even though the hero was Rajendra Kumar and MD Naushad, two Rafi Fans. Even Kalyanji Anandji had many films with Mahendra Kapoor, Mukesh and KK even though Rafi was instrumental in their raise through JAB JAB PHOOL KHILE, AAMNE SAAMNE, etc. LP, by all means Rafi Bhakts, used KK regularly in the early seventies even for Rafi heroes like Jeetendra, Dharmendra, etc. SJ also switched over to KK in movies like MAIN SUNDAR HOON, DIL DAULAT DUNIYA, KAL AAJ AUR KAL, etc. Of course, the music standard came down a notch or two in that period. But, well, it is their prerogative to have whomsoever they wanted though I am sure in heart of heart, why even openly, they would have admitted the superiority of Rafi over all other Singers. Similarly, RDB also used KK for almost all his movies in the early seventies as perhaps he had some special chemistry with him.
However, let us not forget that RDB used Rafi extensively during late sixties as his main playback singer right from the first movie. He gave hit music with Rafi in TEESRI MANZIL, NAQLI NAWAAB, CARAVAN, PYAAR KA MAUSAM, THE TRAIN, ABHILASHA, ADHIKAR, RATON KA RAAJA, etc. Later during late seventies he returned to Rafi and gave hits like SHAAN, HUM KISISE KUM NAHIN, ABDULLAH, ZAMANE KO DIKHANA HAI, etc. In between, he had Rafi in CHANDI SONA qawali with Mannadey (Ek Shok Hasina Se), YADON KI BAARAT (Title song and who can forget the duet with Asha Chura Liya Hai Tumne), DIL KA BAADSHAH (this Raj Kumar starrer had all songs by Rafi), THE GREAT GAMBLER (Raftasa Mera Naam), SHEHZADA (Solo Tere Attaroo and duet with Lata Kaahe Ko Bulaya), etc.
If a person cannot appreciate the greatness of Rafi, then it can be safely concluded that the person does not have a sense of music. Of course, RDB was a good MD though not a great MD like Naushad, Madan Mohan, OP Nayyar, SDB, etc. RD would have definitely known the great qualities of Rafi, the Singer. Just because he did not use Rafi extensively as one would expect, let us not degrade this MD who gave us some good songs in CHANDAN KA PALNA, PADOSAN, HARE RAMA HARE KRISHNA, MERE JEEVAN SAATHI, AJNABEE, AMAR PREM, SANAM TERI KASAM, BHOOT BANGLA, BAHARON KE SAPNE (Rafi solo Zamane Ne Maare), PARICHAY, KINAARA, APNA DESH, ZAHREELA INSAAN, RAMPUR KA LAKSHAMAN (Pyaar Ka Samay with Lata, KK and Rafi), 1942 – A LOVE STORY, KATI PATANG to certain extent, etc. though he gave some very mediocre music in films like DEEWAR, SHOLAY, KITAAB, ZAKHMEE, RAFOO CHAKKAR, NAMKEEN, DHARAM KARAM and BIWI O BIWI (so un-RK film like), etc. so many forgettable movies as for as music was concerned.
The irony of RDB was either he gave good music or petered out to a very mediocre music in so many films. I read some where that Shashi Kapoor called RD as National Anthem Music Director. In those days, theatres used to play National Anthem at the end of the movie and the Hall doors used to be shut till the completion of the Anthem. As soon as the Anthem used to commence, our in-disciplined people used to rush to the Hall Door and wait for the door opening. Similarly, whenever RDB songs commenced in most of the movies, people used to rush to toilet.
Still, it is not fair that we use harsh and sometimes, un-parliamentary language against any body if they differ with our views. We cannot forget the contribution of all these MDs, Heroes, Singers, Directors, etc. in making the Indian Film Music so rich.
Ref Post 349:
Mr. XXX, the 1951-60 period of SDB’s music was indeed excellent. Take any SDB period, and you will find high quality excellent music. In fact if you look at SDB’s career, he produced landmark scores in every decade (50’s, 60’s, 70’s). Had he lived longer I am sure he would have produced landmkar scores even in the 80’s. RDB had the chance to work with modern technology in the late 70’s onwards, something SD did not. Yet, SDB’s music sounds so crystal clear, and that is a tribute to his genius. Imagine Dada Burman’s music in stereo, how amazing that would have been. Then again his music doesn’t need the stereo quality to be great, play it on a good system, and his music will still sound out of this world. SDB’s music was ever young, fresh, and never dated.
Excellent description of “Karvaten badalte rahen” you gave there, and I agree the song seems to be inspired from LP’s “Dhal Gaya Din”. Yes RD also made inspired tunes, with his own stamp, just as SD put his stamp on his compositions.
I would like to mention a point and that is fusion music, I feel many only give RD credit for true fusion and not SD. It is definitely true that RD was a master at fusion music, he combined the best of both worlds in a beautiful way, but so did his father. Many tend to give RDB credit for the majority of SDB’s fusion music. True, RD may have had a hand in the fusion music, but it is absurd in my opinion to credit everything that SD did in fusion or western music to RD. SDB was no junior when it came to the west, he had a strong hold on this genre as he had on traditional music.
There are many examples, some of which I will mention. In the 50’s, there is Hemant’s “Hai apna dil to awara” which is harmonica driven. How about the accordion and SDB, it was different from how SJ used it, traces of it can be found back in 1951 with the songs “Tandi hawayein” and “Saiyan dil maine aana”. This is before RD became his main assistant. How about the saxophone, an integral part of SD’s orchestra, an example “tere mere sapne” (guide) was a mix of traditional and jazz along with the western and SD touch. How about “Megha chhaye aadhi raat” from Sharmilee, what a beautiful mix of east and west with the accordion, sitar, guitar, bongo’s, tabla all rolled into one, and this song has the SDB touch all throughout. Even after RD was no longer SD’s assistant because of his own films, we can still find SD using fusion in many songs one of which is “Ab to hai tumse” (Abhimaan). RD was a master at using the guitar, and SD was strong in this department too, check out the guitar, the bongo’s in the Abhimaan song, all a perfect mix. How about Lata’s “Aa palkon mein aa” where the use of the guitar was anything unlike at that time. Is anyone going to attribute this to a twelve year old RDB (at the time) or maybe the guitar player himself and not SD ?. Btw, SDB also was also excellent at chord based compositions, something RD was also fantastic in. Check out Rafi’s “Apni to har aah”, notice the excellent use of the guitar, and the great “train” effect, brilliant work. Another song with fantastic use of the acousitc guitar is Rafi’s “Khoya Khoya Chand”.
Now tell me, should I credit SD’s western fusion to RDB or Basu-Manohari or Meera Dev Burman or anyone else ?. After all many have said that a good number of SD’s 60’s compositions were by Jaidev and before that N Dutta. So basically, what they’re saying is that SD was never a composer, he left everything to his assistants, and in the end took all the credit. Anyone who says things like this is totally making a joke out of SDB, as SD was a master composer that could compose anything. The assistants were like the techicians, who executed the vision of SDB, and the final touch was also that of SDB. Both SD and RD had similar assistants which was interesting.
When talking about father and son, there are similarities in their music. They fed off beautifully from eachother, if RD was inspired by his dad, then SD also incorporated RD’s ideas into his music as well. However this does not mean others were resposible for SD’s western or fusion music, he was a master himself at that, just as RD was in his own way. Also, RD’s classical music had the SD touch but was in his own style as well. SD’s fusion was different from RD’s, even though they may have had similiraties. RD may have explored this genre further, but SD mixed it very beautifully, he didn’t need to explore it more, it was already in his music as a perect mix. The SDB gharana was amazing, and was full of variety.
So RDB was definitely not the first to make fusion music popular, before him SDB, SJ and others were already working with it. If RD was excellent at chords, rhythm, and melody, SD was also great in of all that. True, RD introduced new rhythm patterns, but so did SD, and he was very innovative in rhythm patterns and played aroud with it as well. His sense of rhythm was completely his own. If RD was a trend-setter, so was SD, if RD changed the sound of music with Teesri Manzil, his father also did with Aradhana.
RD may have popularized the guitar and made it a part of his trademark, but as I mentioned SD was no less in using it greatly. RD also used western instruments in a unique and awesome way, but that doesn’t take anything away from SD’s use of western instruments which were used in SD’s own unique and excellent way too. When it comes to indian instruments, ofcourse SD was brilliant, and RD also was great.
Mr XXX, who in your view was the more talented, gifted, and better composer, SD or RD ?. Please give your reasons as well.
hello mr.myk,,
it was gr8 description of dada,, you mentioned about aise to na dekho,, it was gr8 rendition by rafi sahab along wd andr gem frm d same movie–kahin bekhayal, those two songs were made only for rafi sahab,what a great singing!!!.. also im agree wd u dat “diye jalte hain” sounds to be inspired frm “dunia o dunia” by sachin da…
rdb was genious in dis department also, he made somewhere 50 inspired tunes from diff resouces, from foreign, from his father’s and even frm his contemps…
myk ji if u noticed dat notations of antras of dat pahadi song “karvate badalte rahen” is similar to d lp’s “dhal gya din ho gayi shaam” mukhdaas… pancham only did slight make-up wd tune, changed d taal to vilambit daadra, add 2-3 notes, subtracts 2-3 notes,, juss applied his musical mathematics to lp’s tune..
now regarding sachin da’s golden phase, m agree wd u dat dada was excellent throughout his career but i consider 1951-60 as his golden phase.. as i menntioned earlier dat he hardly repeated him self frm 1951-60,, used almost every singer,, managed to produce gems even wd lesser known singers- dekho maane nahi roothi hasina wd jagmohan bakshi… he was as trendy as classy in dis period, but m agree dat he was excellent till his last movie milli…. but i rate dada no.1 composer of 50s along wd naushad ji
I request others to come forward with some more SDB songs that they think fit the qawwali description, or have the qawwali touch.
I mentioned that SDB didn’t get many chances to compose for qawwalis. However he has made a song with, you can call it a “qawwali touch”, along with classical flavour, and that is Manna’s “Kisne chilman se mara” from ‘Baat Ek Raat Ki’.
The Rafi-SDB combo was one of the most greatest in the history of HFM. As P. Haldar said, they defined what playback singing was all about. Dada explored the full range of Rafi saab’s golden voice, and Rafi saab also had a special SDB crooning style. Their songs together are very haunting, soulful, and everlasting. Guide was the peak of their association, in its full glory.
How about “Aise to na dekho” (Teen Devian), I absolutely adore this composition, only a genius like Dada could have created such a masterpiece. Songs like these were made for Rafi saab, as only he could have sung them.
Ref Post 344:
Mr. XXX,
Dada Burman was an amazing composer, he was in a league of his own, his songs have so much soul in them. The Hemant songs you mentioned are all excellent, SDB used his voice in a great way. Those three Hemant songs rank amongst his very best, I just love ‘na tum hamein jano” what a melody, I wish there was a Rafi version of this song. Look at the tabla pick up in the antara’s, excellent.
In fact I think every singer was at their technical best under Dada. Just think of Lata, Rafi, Kishore, Asha, Geeta, Hemant, Manna etc. they all had a distinct tonal quality under Dada. Ofcourse Rafi saab had a special tonal quality for every composer, such was his genius, but Dada brought out the best in a singer. Also all these singers including Mukesh, have sung their best songs under Dada (besides other composers).
He composed signature tunes for these singers, for example, when we think of Rafi, one song that comes to mind is “Tere mere sapne”, think Mukesh and you have “Chal ri sajni”, think Lata and there is “piya bina piya bina”, think Kishore and you have “Phoolon ke rang se”, think Manna and you have “Poocho na kaise”, think Asha and you have “Ab ke baras bej”, think Geeta and you have “Waqt ne kiya kya”, and many more. He also worked with many lyricists, Hasrat, Shailendra, Sahir, Majrooh, Anand Bakshi, Neeraj, Yogesh, Gulzar etc. and they all worked wonders with his music.
SDB was probably the best folk composer, he also was excellent in western music, a master at classical music, he could compose in all genres, I don’t think he had a chance to compose for qawwali’s or I’m sure he would have done great in that as well.
RDB picked up cues from his father, some of which are his melody aspect, his classical knowledge, the use of the guitar along with the rhythm, it was there in SDB compositions before RD made it his trademark. Isn’t RDB’s “Diye jalte hain” (Namak Haram) similar to Dada’s “Duniya O Duniya” (Naya Zamana), both Kishore songs.
His music was always fresh, ahead of its time, it didn’t belong to the era it was composed in, and he was a trendsetter. His music was modern as well as traditional. If he hadn’t passed away in 75, he would have continued to be a force, as he showed. In the 70’s, LP, RD, KA and others were competing with Dada Burman. His songs not only were mass friendly, but they were very high in quality.
Mr XXX, when do you think was Dada’s best phase as a composer ?. Dada was excellent throughout his career, I don’t think we can point to one phase where his quality was below par, he always maintained a high standard. Even in the early sixties and in the seventies when he had bad health, his music was still excellent. He did about 89 films, less compared to others, but look at the quality, outstanding. He never believed in taking on a lot of work at one time, which was smart.
mr.myk,,
im agree wd u— “”Dada Burman’s violins weren’t as much in quantity compared to SJ or LP, yet they were as classy…””
wats ur views on sachinda’s these compositions wd hemantda::
1.ye raat ye chandani fir kahan—-(if one notice dat how melodiously violins are going wd that rythm based on goa folk…)
2.yaad aa gayi wo nashili nigahen
3.na tum humein jaano, na hum tumhe jaane….
he flattened everyone wd his use of violins in above songs…
i have a great respect for dis divine burman,, i rate him over gr8 shankar-jaikishan as one can notice sachinda hardly used to repeat himself,, also i believe dat sj’s compositions were extremely ornamented beauties & sachinda’s compositios were simple beauties…
sachinda was also eminent fluitist of his time,, he was not at all commercial minded but still ruled the commercial market wd sj….
just go through dis(extracted from an article)……..———-
“””””” Guide had led to another interesting episode. A local filmland publicist-cum agent approached Dada with a proposal that shocked and enraged him. “Give me so much andâ€, the man said, “and you will get the awardâ€. He had come in connection with a popular award hoping that the old man would fall for the offer readily. He was in for a surprise.
“Now look young manâ€, Dada told him, “I will be honest and tell you that I am interested in getting this award though I never knew it could be manipulated or bought. I can afford the money that you are asking for. And I also know that compared to the gains the award might yield the money you ask is nothing. But I would rather give it away to those who had acclaimed my music that buy the award….†“””””””
and also every bengali should be proud of sachinda that he provided a new dimensions to bhatiali & baul,, introduced them into filmi music…
aur sachinda ki gayaki ko hi lelo,, anil biswas to mantra mugdh ho jate the unka gana sunke….
now regarding rafi sahab & sachinda’s combonation… this combination was lethal:::
1.jinhe naaz hai hind par wo kahan hain
2.ye mehlo ye takhto
3.khoya khoya chand
4.tere bin soone nain hamare
5.naache mann mora magan
6.din dhal jaaye
7.tere mere sapne ab ek rang hain
8.hum bekhudi mein tumko pukare chale gaye
9.dekhi zamane ki yaari
10.dil ka bhawar kare pukar…………………………… & many odr gr8s…
im sure that if someone compile d list of top 100 songs of rafi sahab,, above mentioned 10 songs will be there……..
Excellent post on MM Mr. XXX, keep it up !
MM was a class MD, he was an amazing music director, his tunes were so powerful, emotional and everlasting. The melody in his compositions was outstanding and you are right his violins were excellent as well. As mentioned, he could compose in all genres, yet he sometimes gets typecast as only being great in the ghazal genre. He was great till the end, his quality of music never went down.
Talking about violins, all MD’s had their respective styles and ways of using them, and all were outstanding. S-J were masters, their violins were like a western symphony, and “counter melody” was used to great effect with it. L-P followed the SJ tradition with their classy and different orchestra, and both the duo’s were innovative with their use of the violins. RDB’s violins were also unique, he experimented a lot with it just like the two duo’s and it was different from other composers. Dada Burman’s violins weren’t as much in quantity compared to SJ or LP, yet they were as classy, and he used it to embellish his compositions. I would like to mention RR who also used violins in a fantastic way, innovative and experimenting with them as well. K-A also developed their own signature violin style which was great. We can mention so many other composers who had great violins.
I should have added few more songs like “Aapki Nazaron Ne Samaja” and “Jiya Legayoji Mora” of ANPAD, “Baiyan Na Dharo” of DASTAK and “Naina Barse” of WOH KAUN THI to the list given in Post No. 339.
i wanna add one more point:::
although sj,lp & rdb made gr8 use of violins
but
violins sabse jada sur mein tabhi bole hain jab madanji k under mein aaye hain… and its a fact…
consider any gr8 song of mm & feel the melody of violins in it… im sure one will get best phrasing of violins under mm only….
although sj were also gr8 wd their violins & orchestra…
ref to d post 339::
nice post gurumurthy sahab & thanx for correcting me but ya i think “chalti ka naam gaadi” was sdb’s score,, and yes parwana was a good score by mm……..
ref to p 338::
harvinder sahab thanx for adding into my knwldge that laila-majnu score was completed by jaidev….
as far as my mds list is concd, i took every aspect into considerations like mass appeal, class of music, revolutionary impact, selection of singers, consistency…. dats y i gave dat o/p
1.naushad
2.sachin dev burman
3.shankar-jaikishan
4.madan mohan
5.roshan
6.rahul dev burman………
and i believe madan ji was not only gazal samrat,,, he was genious in odr generes also
patriotic– ab tumhare hawale watan…
drunken–(those nums frm dev movies)— sawan ke mahine mein,kabhi na kabhi kahi na kahi……
classical— ja re badra bairi, kon aaya mere mann ke dware,more naina bahaye neer….
playfull—- zaroorat hai shreemati ki kalavati ki, mera naam abdul rehman, ek tha abdul rehman ek thi abdul, bhor aayi gaya andhiyara, sikandar ne porus se,murge ne jhooth bola…..
western based—– shokh nazar ki bijliyaan,tum jo mil gaye ho,dil se dil milakar….
rakhi—- rang birangi raakhi…
romantic– tumse kahu ek baat paro si halki halki halki, bheegi chandni chhayi bekhudi, wo chand muskuraya…
sad mood—- mai ri, uthti hai har nigah, aaj socha to aasu bhar aaye, rasme ulfat,….
for parents—— Jab tak hai akash mein
note– this is just a sample,, the list of gr8 songs is endless….
Dear XXX,
“Gairon Ke Karam” is from AANKHEN for which music was by Ravi. However, I was really to happy to read about the other songs listed in your post. Lataji’s all time greats shall definitely include “Nainon Me Badara Chaye” from MERA SAAYA, “Lag Ja Gale” from WOH KAUN THI, “Betaab Dilki” from HANSTE ZAKHM, “Zarasi Aahat” from HAQEEQAT and “Hum Pyaar Me Jalnewalon Ko” from JAILOR. MM also utilised Talat very well with his Gazals and if one notices, KK was utilised by MM in a quite different way than other MDs, just listen to songs from CHALTI KA NAAM GAADI, PARWANA, etc. Regarding Rafi & MM combination, it was “SIMPLY SUPERB”.
xxx ji, your post in praise of MM is well taken, though he never got mass or commercial recognition of his true talent, and died of alcohol and depression. His son Sanjeev Kohli regrets to date for not praising his dad’s compositions when he was alive and craved for recognition. I list him # 2, after SJ # 1 (Lata ji rates him # 1 and SJ # 2). I see that he is # 4 in your list and commercialy successful RD # 6 – I respect your assessement, but beg to differ.
Naushad saheb once stated that two of MM’s compositions “Agar mujhse mohabbat hai” and “Aapki nazron nein samjha pyar ke kabil mujhe” can match half of his own (Naushad’s entire work).
MM was the only music director who challenged the genius of Lata’s voice, took her to extra mile and took to dizzy heights, others only made maximum use of it.
Lata silences MM’s critics when he is branded as “Good for ghazals and Lata only”. She reminds the critics to listen to two extremities in Mohd Rafi saheb’s voice under MM in “Rang aur noor ki saugat kisse paish karoon” and ultra soft “Ik haseen shaam ko dil mera kho gaya”. I however do not want to believe that music of Veer zarra is of MM saheb, for following reasons AA) He passed away in 1975, and even then Laila Majnu was completed by Jaidev in 1976. BB) Music has deteriorated so much since then. It seems a gimmick to cash in on his name. After all RDB also benefited a lot of it on his father’s name and Asha on RDB’s name as double edged sword.
myk sir, harvinder sahab,,
nice trivias were posted by both of you,, plz keep adding on these most underrated superstars:::
>ravi ji
>chitragupt ji
>vasant desai ji
>c.ramchandra ji
and let everybody know abt them……….
well now i wud like to through some light on another gr8 & my personal fav composer from yesteryears … madan mohan sahab..
after assisting dada burman for a short time in late 40s he scored his debut album in 1950– AAkhen…
and wat a gr8 album it was,,
>hum ishq mein barbaad hain(gr8 rendition by rafi ji)
>preet lagake maine
>kismat ne humein majboor kiya
and all odr songs from dis album were true gems..
madan ji was truly gr8,, really i dn have any words abt gr8ness of his music..
sab log kehte hain ki lataji ne ye kiya wo kiya,, agr hum madan mohan sahab ka yogdaan hata de to koi mujhe samjhayega ki didi ne kya kiya auro se hatkar???
juss consider these albums
>mera saya(1966)
*naino mein badra chhaye—–(well well well,,, i think dis song alone can rank him along side d gr8est mds ever, the best composition ever made in raag bheempalasi(no doubt in my mind), juss listen to d antras of d songs,, wat a fine balance he made between classical music & light music,, i mean how one can be so magical?? the way he moved from one note to another was just amazing,, and how superbly he made use of those two “dhevats(6th note))” in a song,, also gr8 use of sitar,santoor & violins together,, well i can eaisly write a book on dis song alone… gr8 song by truly gr8 maestro)
*tu jahan jahan chalega(gr8 song again)
*jhumka gira re
>dulhan ek raat ki
*ek haseen shaam ko dil mera kho gya(juss listen to d way afi sahab sung “shaaaaam ko”— sheer magic)
*kisi ka kuch
*maine rang li aaj chunariya(again sheer magic by mm in raag piloo,, madan sahab ke bht ehsaan hain lataji pe)
>wo kaun thi
*naina barse rimjhim
*lag ja gale
*shokh nazar ki bijliyaan(aur log kehte hain ki madan sahab sirf gazle achhi banate the)……
>jahan ara
*kisi ki yaad mein
*wo chup rahe to
>dekh kabira roya
*kon aaya mera mann ke dware(bht melodious insaan the madanji,, manna da ne is gane ko bht achha gaya hai)
and many odr gr8 albums like
*haqeekat
*adalat
*anpadh
*man mauji
*sanjog
*maa ka aanchal
******dastak*******
and who can forget madanji’s gr8 contribution to 70s
*haste zakham
*dil ki raahen
*mausam(gr8 use of bhupinder’s voice in dat nostalgic song)
*laila-majnu(even d weakest score(so called) of madanji was so melodious)
aur jate jate madanji k kuch sadabahar nagme
*ja re badra bairi ja
*preetam daras dikhao
*bhor aayi gaya andhiyara
*tum bin jeevan kaisa jivan
*aapke pehlu mein(gr8 rendition by rafi ji)
*teri aakho ke siva
*tum jo mil gaye ho
*hum pyar mein jalne walo ko chain kahan haye aaram kahan
*gairon ke karam, apno pe sitam………
******long live madan mohan******
Thanks Mr. Harvinder and Mr. XXX for your nice posts.
Mr. XXX, that is a great list of RDB albums. I fully agree with you, Rafi saab brought melody to Pancham’s music and I would like to add that the RDB/Rafi combination was an amazing mix of music and voice.
Now for the trivia related to “The Burning Train” (1980):
a) BR Chopra produced this film, and we all know Ravi was his favourite MD. What is interesting is that Ravi was present for the recording of every song from this film, and was also helping out Pancham. I have also heard that Ravi assisted Pancham during that period as well. Sahir was the lyric writer for TBT, and he was also a BR Chopra favourite.
b) This film had the beautiful masterpiece qawwali ‘pal do pal ka saath hamara’. The sound of the train is used in this song as well as in the title music. Pancham and his sound recordist Deepan Chatterjee went to the Bombay Central railway station to record the train sounds.
mr.myk,,
nice post again ,,, plz keep adding interesting facts on chitragupt, ravi, cr, opn, lp,rr,rj ………..
and it wud b pleasure if u will post those trivias on ur next post…
now concerning 15 best rdb albums,, its a tough call ,,but iam mentioning 15+ gr8 rdb albums in diff way….
5 bests wd majrooh— teesri manzil, yado ki baarat, hum kisise kum nahi,carvan,kudrat
4 bests wd anand bakshi— pati-patni, chandan ka palna, amar prem,kati patang
4 bests wd gulzar— ijazat, kinara, aandhi, masoom..
& some good albums wd odrs like
(sanam teri kasam, satte pe satta, kasme vaade wd gulshan baawra)
1942als wd javed
padosan, bombay to goa wd rajinder krishan…. & still more can be added
and i think rafi sahab really did gr8 job wd pancham,, added melody into rdb’s songs which we found missing in kk’s renditions..
as one can see that rafi sahab really added some special ingrediants to the pancham’s mediocre composition ek bechara pyar ka maara and made d song good,,
kk also did justice wd pancham’s gr8 tunes but was kk really had the talent to make a mediocre composition a good song(like mighty rafi sahab had)
…
ans is simply no.. as pancham’s mediocre compositions wd kk like walla kya nazara hai,mujko agr ijazat ho are not even bearable…
Thank you myk and your post 333. I concur with you every bit on the sweetness and melody of Ravi and Chitragupt. I was just watching Ravi sahebs melody in Bharosa (Woh dil kahan se laoon teri yaad jo bhula de – what a composition). Ravi saheb was very fond of Rafi Saheb and always stated that Rafi has to be heard from heart and not only by the ears. I have heard an interseting tale about BR Chopra’s waqt. BRChopra did not fancy OPNayyar and Rafi after the duo stole the thunder from his movie Naya Daur and as a result wanted to avoid Rafi’s influence on WAQT despite Ravi wanting Rafi Saheb. Upon completion of recordings of all remaing songs, Ravi smartly approached BRChopra for the title song’s composition which was far beyond any other singer’s ability, with Rafi as the only alternative in mind. To this BRChopra agreed. Ravi played another trick by quoting a phenomenal amount of 10,000 Rs (in 1965) which was higher than the entire amount paid to other singers for the remaing songs. Surprisingly, BR Chopra – an astute businessman making a mega starrer agreed to pay. Rafi Saheb sang the song and distributed the entire money amongst lowly paid musicians. Such was the character and pride of MD’s and singers those days.
Thank you Mr. XXX, please do write more as well.
Ravi, like Chitragupt was a very under-rated composer. He came to the industry to be a singer, and became an assistant to Hemant Kumar. He had no formal training in classical music, yet he could compose classical songs and wonderful gems.
Again like Chitragupt, he was never part of the rat race, and kept on producing wonderful music. Ravi had an excellent sense of melody, his songs had that “sweet” factor, and this made him successful. He wasn’t as flashy in his orchestration like an SJ or RDB, and he also displayed his composing talent through the variety of instruments he used in his arrangements. His trademark and trump card was solid melody. Ravi had a tendency to come up with many tunes based on the meter of lines. He always preferred lyrics to be written first and then composed tunes.
Ravi had the longest association with the BR Chopra Banner, and he gave that banner a lot of great music. Ravi was another ‘Rafian’ composer, he reserved his cream for ‘Saatwan Sur’. Mahendra Kapoor also got a chance to shine under Ravi’s baton. Besides being successful in HFM music, Ravi also composed for a lot of Southern films.
In my next post I will share two interesting pieces of trivia related to the film “The Burning Train” (1980), composed by RDB.
I have just written briefly on both Ravi and Chitragupt, there is so much more to their story. In future posts, I will continue sharing things about these composers as well as others.
———————-
Mr. XXX,
I would like to know what your Top 10 RDB Albums are. Please list them, and if 10 is too less then you can make it 15.
Ref. post # 330: True, Chitragupt gave melodious songs, I consider him better than R.D. Burman.
mr.myk,,,
it was nice description of chitragupt…
hope u add on ravi too….
Everyone has their own views and opinions which is great, and its nice to see an interesting discussion taking place here, where everyone is contributing from different angles.
Chitragupt was an excellent composer, he created a variety of beautiful songs. What was unique about his orchestra was his use of violins. They had a very distinct sharp touch that became his trademark. He definitely saved his cream for Lata and Rafi as did most composers. He was a low-profile MD, not as famous as his contemporaries, but still managed to hold his own with the songs he composed. His music had the indian fragrance with a modern touch. His arrangements were very clean, and uncluttered, and he was very strong on orchestration. A very under-rated composer, he deserves more appreciation.
ref to p 328::
iam agree wd mr.gurumurthy—-“it is a fact that LP could not match their own standard of 1963 to 73 in the later years”
no doubt that laxmikant-pyarelal were great music directors,, because of
1.their strong belief in indian melody
2.right selection of singers(they never used kk unusually like pancham)
3.adding commercial tadka into song or we can say that their songs were nice blend of class & mass appeal…
4.and ofcourse both were highly talented…
the only field(odr than commercial) in which pancham lags from lp is “selection of singers”
i think sometimes dosti dominates d farz,,, dats wt hapnnd in pancham’s case,, he always prefferd his frnds…
consider his gr8 father sdb,, he was very close to manna da & kk but he played his farz as music dir sincerely & gave his best compositions to d best singer(rafi ji)…. but pancham unfortunately didnt….
lets take these to songs of father & son..
1.naache mann mora magan(meri surat teri aakhen by sdb)
2.mithe bol bole payaliya(kinara byy rdb)
similarities bw these songs
>both songs were based on bhairvi & teen-taal
>both were very sweet compositions
>tabla is major attraction of rythm in both songs..
now dada always knew dat only rafi sahab could do more dan justiice wd these type of sweet compostions, so he employed rafiji and as a result song registerd itself into legendry songs,,
now wat pancham did,, he simply ignored classical gr8s(rafi,manna,yesudas) & prefferd his good friend guitarist bhupinder(although he was good classical singer but not gr8 ),, as one can see that didi totally dominating in dis song,,, i think bhupinder failed to bring meldy…
so as a result that song although capable but never found its place into gr8 classical compoitions,,,
i believe that rdb’s most of selections were totally wrong,, but he is still a legend,,
i consider only these mds as revolutionary gr8s
1.naushad(surely numero uno)
2.dada burman
3.sj
4.mm
5.roshan
6.rdb
Both Rafi and Lata have openly acknowledged the talent of LP. Even in the late seventies when the general music standard came down from the high pedestal of 50s and 60s, these two stalwarts admitted that only LP give good music. Of course, it is a fact that LP could not match their own standard of 1963 to 73 in the later years, perhaps due to a combination of reasons like changing tastes, deterioration in the quality of lyrics, commercial interests, churning out songs in a short time, demise of Rafi and Mukesh, ageing of other stalwart singers like Mannadey, Hemant, Talat, Mahendra, etc. Even SJ suffered this problem as they could not mainatain their own standard of 1949 to 1968 in the later years due to several factors like their over-reliance on Sharada and other factors listed above and also another important factor was the demise of Jaikishan. That way, only and only Naushad, SDB, MM,OPN, Ravi, Chitraguta, CR, Jaidev and Roshan maintained their music quality from their first film to the last.
Thank you XXX. Our lists differ so drastically to the extent that LP’s melody does not figure in your top 13 – I think our likes are diffrent.
MYK has thrown some light on LP. I request Mr Haldar also expresses his comments on LP’s music, we have had our diffrence of opinion on RDB though. Please, try listning to Chitragupt’s compositions – off late I have been listning to his songs sung by Rafi and Lata and they are all very soothing with a touch of class in Akash Deep, Bhabhi etc… Listen to Ravi in Nai Roshni, Kaajal, Khandaan etc… SHEER MAGIC
refer to p:: 322
mr.harvinder,,
i respect ur views on ravi & chitragupt,,but iam highly addicted of these composers
1.naushad
2.sachin dev burman
3.shankar-jaikishan
4.madan mohan
5.roshan
6.rahul dev burman
dats y my knowledge is very limited in case of d most of odr gr8s,,
1.salil chaudhary
2.anil biswas
3.ravi
4.op nayyar
5.chitragupt
6.vasant desai
7.c ramchandra….
ya but i found mr.myk & mr.p haldar amongst d most knowledgeble rafins in dis forum so i think they can view us better aspects of odr gr8 composers through their posts
it wud b pleasure for me if you or mr.myk or mr.haldar or any odr rafian will express their views on d above gr8s… as these composers really deserve a lot of hype which is unfortunately they dont getting…..
Mr XXX (Ref Post 321):
Lakhon Mein Ek is an alright album, compared to other RDB albums, its not really something memorable, “Chanda O Chanda” is probably the only song that lives on from that soundtrack.
Yes we can easily name more than 100 albums out of the 500 by LP. Saying LP only produced 100 odd quality albums in their whole career is like saying Nadeem Shravan have produced more quality than Shankar Jaikishan. LP didn’t manage to stay on top for that long if they only produced 100 odd quality albums. There are so many quality albums in LP’s whole career, as well as after 1973, that can match your list, I can’t list all of them so I will pick and choose (post 1973). This is just the tip of the iceberg:
Dost
Aasha
Prem Kahani
Roti Kapda Aur Makaan
Hum Paanch
Naach Uthe Sansar
Badalte Rishte
Dostana
Nagin
Naseeb
Kali Ghata
Sargam
Do Premee
Karz
Suhaag
Hero
Pyar Jhukta Nahin
Utsav
Sur Sangam
Satyam Shivam Sundaram
Harvinder is right, LP were always a step ahead of RDB, they manged to attract more big banners, they were ahead in the hit parade, and they were more commercially successful than him. Now do you attribute this to lack of quality ?. Post 1973 many banners could have dropped LP in a second and switched to the competition, but they didn’t, why, because LP stood for quality music. The best sellers of HMV, Polydor and other big music companies contain so many LP albums, from their whole career, so the notion that they only produced quality for ten years (1963-1973) is not true in my view.
Rafi saab kept every composer’s quality very high, as he was the greatest singer ever. These composers were all very talented, and they created amazing compositions, but with Rafi present, their amazing compositions became even more amazing with his golden voice and unmatched skills, range, and talent. Furthermore, it’s not only LP who suffered after Rafi passed away, RDB, RR, KA etc., along with the whole music industry all suffered as well. Everyone’s music in the 80’s (LP, RDB, KA etc.) generally was not of the same standard as their earlier work in previous years, with the exception of choice albums.
Everyone has their own views, and that’s great. Your views don’t have to change, nor do you have to be convinced of anything, this is just a great healthy debate. I feel though that if we continue, we’ll just be repeating ourselves, as we’ve already discussed this in detail before.
Cheers 🙂
ref post 312:
shirish bhai, I’ve written the rebuttal and sent it to the administrator; it should be posted soon. I don’t think rafians should take this kind of garbage lightly. We should all try to expose raju b, who I’m beginning to believe is an inveterate liar. It’s going to be an all-out war. And we should all write to Hindustan Times to register our protest, probably threatening them with legal action if they don’t apologise. Enough is enough!
refer to p 320::
mr. p halder,,
obviously u r mentioning abt guide but i have mentioned abt sdb’s variety from 1950-1960,, sdb was only composer from 50s who never repeated himself,,,
his range was unbelievable in 50s,, from ye raat ye chandni(dis song shows gr8 orchastretion skills of sdb) to jaye to jaye kahan to jinhe naaz hai hind par to jivan k safar mein raahi to hum bekhudi mein to chalti ka naam gaadi to sujata to manzil to folk music of bombay ka baabu to hai apna dil to awaara to dekhi zamane ki yaari,,,
however sdb didnt gave dat much variety into 60s bcoz of obvious health reasons,, but he still managed to gave gems like
1.guide
2.meri surat teri aakhen(i rate dis album as best of sdb in 60s, rafi sahab ne jaan daal di naache mann mora magan mein)
3.baat ek raat ki
4.tere ghar ke saamne
5.jewel theif
6.araadhna
7.bandini
8.talaash
9.jyoti
10.teen deviyaan(juss listen to d rafiji’s kahin bekhayal,, rafi sahab ka jawab nahi)
and ya i think later u mentioned abt “tere ghar ke saamne”,, and that composition “tu kahan ye bata” sounds more like sdb’s own creation… but dada never consider dis album among his best(i dn know why?),, as when he cut d disc of 20 years wd navketan(in 1970),, he plucked for us d choicest flowers from d garden of navketan & no song from “tere ghar ke saamne” found d place on d disk….
Thanks XXX and your post 321. I do not have the exact numbers to support LP’s brilliance as far as melody is concerned, but there are a few notable omissions in your list e.g; Sajan (Resham ki dori), Raja aur Runk, Roti Kapda aur Makaan, Anita to name few. LP’s songs are so soothing to listen to. Amar Akbar Anthony, Chachbhatija, Dharamveer were their numbers in mid 70’s.
I have great respect for SDB and his quality music, but I also considered the overall impact of LP’s music. If RDB can be discussed so much than LP is ahead of RDB on most accounts, but not recognised half as much as RDB.
Percentage wise and impact wise OPNayyar saheb would give any MD run for their money, but I did not list him in my top five as he is beyond comparison. Almost all his songs send chill waves down listners spine.
I know mention of Ravi and Chitragupt may also not go well with many, but to me they are unsung heroes with very high quality and clean music. I accept that you have more knowledger of Music than me. Can you or Mr Haldar please comment on Ravi & Chitragupt music after listning to some of their songs and decide for yourself if we need to talk so much about RDB.
refer to p 318::
mr.myk,,
lakho mein eik was again a nice album by rdb in 1971,, music of dis movie eaisly goes wd d story,, i think it was gr8 music,,,
and yes all three(rdb,ka,lp) conributed towards quality in 70s & 80s but i believe rdb contributed maximum…..although i respect ur immense knowledge abt hfm but i really not convinced wd ur views on lp,,,
as i said earlier we cant name more dan 100 evergreen albums among there 500+ albums,, ya commercially all 500 might b gr8 but im talking of quality..
i consider the 1963-73 period as a glorious 10 years of lp in terms of quality..
just check out these gr8 albums in dis period & im sure u will not get these type of gr8 o/p by lp in post 73 era…
1.parasmani(sixer in first ball by lp,,needless to say abt gr8ness of dis album)
>wo jab yaad aaye(i lv dis num,, )
>roshan tumhi se dunia
>hasta hua noorani
2.sati savitri
>jeevan dor tumhi sang
>tum gagan ke chanrma(nice song based on kalyan..)
3.sant gyaneshwar
>khabar mori na linhi re(my fav shivranjini based composition)
>jyot se jyot jagate
4.dosti(each & every song was gem)
>chahunga main tujhe
>raahi manva
>mera to jo b kadam
>jaanewale o zara..
5.shreeman funtoosh(gr8 album wd kk,, lp used kk wonderfully in dis album like burmans did)
>ye dard bhara afsana
>balma kitna naadan hai
>mera saavla salona mehboob
>wo jharoke se
6.sau saal baad
>abke baras ye bahar
>bhoola hua fasana
>kisiki nazar ne ishara kiya hai
>na jaiyo raadha chhedenge shyam
7.pyar kiye jaa
>din jawani ke chaar(nice num)
8.aaye din bahar ke(gr8 album having gr8 rafiji’s numbers)
>suno sajna
>mere dil se sitamgar tune
>phulo se mukhde wali
>mere dushman tu
9.aasra
>shokhiyaan nazar mein
>tum kon ho batao
>mere soone jivan ka aasra
10.taqdeer
>agar ho sake to mujhe bhool jana(nice rafiji number)
>aaiye bahar ko hum
11.pathhar ke sanam
>title song
>koi nahi hai(wat a gr8 rythm,, lp transformed simple keherva to extremely catchy rythm,, gr8 lata number)
12.mere humdan mere dost
13.milan
14.jine ki raah
15.aaya sawan jhoom ke(among my most fav)
16.do raaste
17.do bhai
18.khilona
19.satyakaam
20.aan milo sajna
21.aap aaye bahar aayi
22.daag
23.loafer
24.mehboob ki mehendi
and many odr gr8 albums can b added,, now tell me one lp’s post 73 album dat cud match d quality of above albums…
post 1973, lp’s level was maintained by gr8 rafi sahab till 1980 & than lp collapsed in terms of quality(except few albums),, dats wat i think,,, ya but they really gave some nice numbers in 80s too like tere mere beech mein(anodr nice composition in shivranjini),, but most of their output was mediocre
note– iam not imposing my views on anybody,, all my views are based on my personal understanding of music,, sry if sommeone hurts or differs….
ref post 319:
xxx, good post again, but you missed out the real one. The film had 3 rafi solos, 3 lata solos, 1 kishore-lata duet and 1 solo from the maestro himself. I’m sure you know which one I’m referring to. At various times, I have seen 5 of these solos being ranked as the greatest song ever! And the duet in pahadi still enthralls listeners. There is a ninth song, based on a Bengali folk tune, which has been reused by Boppi da — wonder when rb is going to interview him — with great success.
There is another film that you missed where, if witnesses are to be believed, pancham composed a rafi solo to go on dev looking for his lover. And, according to legend, a bee sting on the beach gave him the idea of “ooh ooh ooh ooh” for another song in the same film. The nightingale has sung this song in her shraddhanjali series. I haven’t heard it myself, but if you have, please let me know how it compares.
refer to d post 317::
mr.harvinder,,
i also respect your views ……
but
rating lp over sdb!!!
dis is really harsh towards sdb’s divine music,, even sdb’s single song wd rafi sahab–“jinhe naaz hai hind par”,, is enuf to overshadow lp’s music….
in terms of versatality sj’s were numero uno …..but i think in 50s sdb was more prolific & melodious than sj…..
juss listen to sdb’s variety again…..(from 1950-60)
1.baazi
2.jaal
3.taxi ddriver
4.funtoosh
5.munimji
6.paying guest
7.kala paani
8.kala baazar
9.devdas
10.sujata
11.pyasa
12.kagaaz ke phool
13.manzil
14.solva saal
15.bombay ka baabu
16.nau do gyarah…
& many odrs….,,, music,orchestration,interludes of each of d above movies were totally differs frm each odr
do u really think dat lp ever gave dat much quality music during their 3 decades long career(wd 500+ movies)???
its really strange to rank lp over sdb……..
ya lets hope for d best dat rafi sahab will awarded wd bharat ratna,, he didnt got earlier simply bcoz his genious was beyond any awards….
XXX (Ref Post 315):
Great write-up, keep on writing more such posts !.
Just wanted to add these other RDB albums in 1971:
Adhikar
Hulchul
Pyar Ki Kahani
Hungama
Lakhon Mein Ek
Out of the above five, none really stand out like his other albums in the same year. There are probably only a few songs from each of those films that are good. The best RDB albums in my view of 1971 (in no particular order) were Caravan, Amar Prem, HRHK and Mela.
Since we’ve already discussed RD, LP, KA etc. in the 70’s and 80’s, I don’t want to go into it again, but in my view all those three and others contributed greatly to the quality of the 70’s and 80’s, and not just RDB. Everyone has their own views, and that’s awesome.
Thanks XXX and your posts 315 and 316.
I admire your reserch and respect you for that. I can not dispute the number of good songs RDB gave music to, but he can never be my favorite and will not figure in top five of any personality (Surprisngly, he does figure #5 in great OPNayyar saheb’s list) It could be because they were personal friends.
My ranking is
1) Shankar Jaikishan – No debate here
2) Madan Mohan – No compromise here
3) Naushad
4) Laxmikant Pyarelal – I know this will upset some
5) SD Burman, Ravi or Chitragupt (Listen to their melody)
I hope our Rafi Saheb gets BHARAT RATNA.
refer to d post 314::
correction—“kk was far behind from rafi sahab”
refer p 299:
m.harvinder,,
i think ur comments on rdb are really unfair to hfm,, as whole hfm faternity consider him gr8 & i believe dat he was only versatile genious happened after shankar-jaikishan…..
lets take two decades 70s & 80s,, & for sure rdb’s music contributed maximum in terms of quality(in 70s & 80s)…….
consider the year 1971,, rdb’s output for this year was—
1.amar prem
>raina beeti jaye(among d finest compositions based on todi,, & asusually pancham played d rythm(3-taal dis time) unlike any odr md,, rythm of dis song is very catchy)
>bada natkhat hai re(very sweet composition)
odr numbers from dis album were also good
2.hare rama hare krishna
>dum maro dum(best hip hop ever composed by hfm)
>phulo ka taro ka(raksha bandhan anthom)
>kanchi re(andor nice composition)
>hare rama hare(asha & usha utthap number)
3.carvan
>piya tu ab to(best cabret ever composed)
>chadti jawani(nice duet)
>kitna pyara vaada
>goriya kahan tera desh re
4.paraya dhan
>aaj unse pehli
>dil haye mera dil
5.budhha mil gya
>raat kali(nice kk number)
>aayo kahan se ghanshyam
>jiya na laage mora
6.mela
>rut hai milan ki
>gori ke hath mein(juss check out rythm, rdb was undisputed king of rythms)
now can u name me any one composer who gave dat much variety of music wd quality remained intacted(in 70s),,,, i firmly believe dat rdb contributed maximum in terms of quality in 70s & 80s…
also we cant deny rdb’s contribution to early 80s.. from 80-83 rdb gave many quality albums,, even a single song humein tumse pyar(both male & female) speaks enuf abt his talent, but he rarely got d chance to compose these type of songs as he mostly got d movies demanding youthful music….
it was year 1984 where he gave 14 craps in a row & tahn most of big banners went to lp, bappi,rj… & post 1984 rdb did 90% crap movies so was d music..
but he still managed to gave gems like ijazat,jeeva,libas,sagar,1942a lv stry…. it was mediocre film making dat ruined rdb in 80s….
now concerning the era of 60s,, the 60s were ruled by d truly gr8 composers like naushad, sdb,mm,sj & roshan….. lp also did d gr8 job in 60s & gave us gems like wo jab yaad aaye, khabar mori na linhi re(top class composition)…
but rdb also did d fine job wd
1.teesri manzil(gr8 & revolutionary album wd lord of playback singing rafi sahab)
2.padosan(most comic album hfm has ever produced is also under rdb’s bag)
3.baharo ke sapne
4.chandan ka palna
5.pyar ka mausam
6.pati patni
7.abhilasha
8.chhote nawab
among d many gr8 composers i consider naushad ji as d best ,, as he always managed to gave quality albums even in his lean phase(by quality work or album i mean the album having the evergreen songs not bounded by particular era, as i dn know much abt commercial stats so by quality i dont mean commercial succes)
some of d naushad’s all time gr8 albums are
1.mela(1949)
>ye zindagi ke mele(gr8 rafi sahab number)
>rimjhim ke geet(nice rafiji-lataji duet)
>main bhawar too(nice mukesh shamshad duet)
>gaye je geet milan ke
>mera dil todne wale
2.andaaz
>jhoom jhoom ke naacho aaj
>koi mee dil mein
>uthaye ja unke sitam
>tu kahe agar(nice num by mukesh)
3.dillagi(rare treat for rafi sahab’s fans)
>tere kooche mein
>is dunia mein aey dil walo(both these rafiji’s numbs wre gr8)
4.dulari
>suhani raat dhal chuki(pathbreaking song into hfm)
>takdeer jaga k aaye(lata)
>aakhon mein aaja
>raat rangili mast nazare(nice rafiji-lataji duet)
5.baabul
>milte hi aakhen dil hua diwana(nice duet)
>dunia badal gayi
6.deedar(4 gr8 rafiji’s numbers)
>hue hum jinke liye barbaad
>meri kahani bhoolne wale
>dekh liya maine
>naseeb dar pe tere
7.jadoo
>lo pyar ki ho gayi jeet
>nadaan mohabat
>ab raat milan ki
>roop ki dushman
8.aan
>maan mera ehsaan
>tujhko kho diya humne
>gao tarane man ke
9.baiju baawra
>mann tarpat hari darshan ko(dis song becoming most popular & prefferable bandish for raag malkos in music schools of today)
10.amar
>radha ke pyare krishan kanahai
>na milta gam to
>na sikwa hai koi
>jane wale se mulakat(gr8 lata num)
11.mother india
12.mugle-azam
13.kohinoor
>madhuban mein raadhika(gr8 composition in hamir)
>dhal chuki shaame gam(gr8 rendition by rafiji)
>do sitaro ka milan
14.ganga jamuna
15.mere mehboob
16.leader
17.ram aur shyam
>aaj ki raat mere
>aaye hain bahar mite zulmo sitam
>maine kab tujhse kaha
18.dil diya dard liya
>koi saagar dil ko
>fir teri kahani yaad aayi
>guzre hai aaj ishq mein
19.aadmi(gr8 rafi sahab songs )
>aaj purani raaho se
>na aadmi ka koi bharosa
>main tooti hui ek naiya hoon
>kaisi haseen aaj baharo ki raat(gr8 song)
20.sangharsh
>jab dil se dil takrata hai(andr gr8 rafi-naushad number from late 60s)
i believe dat naushad sahab always conquered the quality field,, also naushad ji was first person who exploited the real talent of rafi sahab wd songs like suhani raat dhal chuki & album baiju baawra….
every one shud b indebt of dis composer for giving us the rare pearls of sur-taal & kohinoor of hfm- rafi sahab
accn to me top 10 ranking of mds wud be:::
1.naushad
2.sachin dev burman
3.shankar-jaikishan
4.madan mohan
5.roshan
6.rahul dev burman
7.c.ramchandra, salil chaudhary
8.op nayyar
9.laxmikant-pyarelal
10kalyanji-anandji……………..
refer to d post 303::
“”””With due respect to everyone India till date can’t produce a dynamic singer like Kishore Kumar and music director like Rahul Dev burman who have created and gave us the creations and magic with same pace. “”””
mr. indranil,,
>i have already xpressed my views on rdb but as far as kk concd, i believe dat he was not even 10% of rafi sahab…….
kk was good only in one dimension-playful mood songs but rafi sahab was xpert iin every dimension & genere of singing….
>rdb was
always aware of genious of rafi sahab but he used kk bcoz of d special bonding between them,, like raj kapoor prefferd mukesh not bcoz of he was superior to odrs,, raj kapoor & mukesh were gr8 frnds dats y raj gave him prefference over odrs…
>kk never gave d variety that rafi sahab gave to us frm bhajans to classical to rock n roll to romantic to sad melodies to gazals to daadra…
kk was far away from rafi sahab,, although kk was good singer,gr8 artist & grtest comedian hindi film industry has ever poduced but in terms of singing he was far behind from rafiji…………
>kk himself also accepted dis fact dat rafi sahab was far away from him…. so there is no question left on rafi sahab’s superiorty…….
Nothing was impossible for Rafi Saheb. he could sing “any” song with ease.
Aaajaaa Aaaa Aaaajaa’ Asha Ji had many story abount this song I don’t know wh0t is true,once on Sharjah TV she said no one can win Mohd Rafi and she was not able to sing this song with Mohd Rafi!!!!!!!?????????.
Dear Binu sir,
Thanks for consoling me. Would you me kind enough to reproduce the signed article of CR ? That will help me sleep in peace!
Haldar Sahab, It is time you come out with your rebuttal against Mr. Raju Bharatan, which you have promised. Ab, paani sar ke ooper chad chooka hai!
Shirish Kulkarni
A legend who sings some of the most difficult hindi film songs
cannot get the nuance of “aaja Aa aajaa”… it’s absurd.
please listen to rafi’s two english numbers which he has rendered so
majestically.
some one is lying herein or some one is playing some “games”
which they have played all their lives…
binu nair.
shirish ji….
u must be knowing that after a certain age, the mind starts acting
like a little child.
I am talking about certain old people who lose their mental balance
and raju bharatan is in the same leage…
he is old and he has no fresh stocks so he reproduces “old thrash”
to fill the columns. It benefits him as “they” become controversial.
this element is called “yellow journalism” in journalistic parlance.
now read what c.ramchandra said after rafi saabs demise .. in a
signed article.
c.r. had recorded just ten days back ( in july 1980 a private song )
with the farishta rafi saab.. he paid great tributes to rafi saab and
came to know about the true worth of rafi saab – a bit late.
this was due to the lata effect…..
c . r. and lata were very close and rumours were there that they
would get married – but it did not happen…
later lata turned against c.ramchandra and the films dried up along
with the cash.
to survive, he sold his assets. he was admitted to the k.e.m. hospital
with old age and sickness – forlorn and forgotten.
when rafi saab died, c.r. realised his mistakes (rather late in the day)
and paid glowing to rafi saab .
raju bharatan should check his facts before writing and apologise to
readers ‘for” continuing to indulge in “sensational journalism” which
do not stand scrutiny.
binu nair.. mumbai.
Mr. Raju Bharatan is at it again. He seems to head a “Malign Rafi” brigade.
In an article in Hindustan Times today on the occasion of C. Ramchandra’s birthday, he has unnecessarily dragged Rafi Sahab’s name. He has quoted CR as saying that Kishore was a great artiste, a great singer. Then he adds his below the belt blow and says, CR, later like RDB, did not care for Rafi (Sahab).
Is this the sort of language a legend like Rafi Sahab deserves? Shame on you Mr. Raju Bharatan
Shirish Kulkarni
Mr. syed: asha bhonsle is playing games as she is the wife
of r.d.b (the third).
don’t get fooled by ashas live comments as raju bharatan has
also written that in the duets of kashmir ki kali, rafi saaheb finished
his part in half an hour but asha culd not get it ‘even’ after few
hours of painstaking effort…
raju was in the studios as he was the assistant editor of
the illustrated weekly of india and its music critic.
secondly all singers have few singing problems which raju
is not reporting… the composers train the singers and make them
sing.
do u know that lataji fainted during a naushad saab recording..
would u write her off and would raju bharatan ‘shout’ from the
roof-tops .
no.. such things happen.. .. but there are selfish interests at work
“Never forget this”… and please don’t get in to the bandwagon of
any camps…
binu nair… the rafi foundation… binus2000@hormail.com
World knows Rafi Saheb was far better singer than KK, and if RDB really preferred KK over Rafi Saheb then its because both were Bengalis, nothing else!
#303 indranil: kishore kumar was one of a kind no doubt – but part of the reason why you can’t see someone even close today is because there are no music directors today to make use of singing talent. if kishore kumar were alive today – there’s a chance he’d be doing very few songs because only few compositions would be worth his time. if you see shows today – some singers have the natural talent but lack the training or direction or are confused in how they should render – they need guidance and we just don’t have the mds to do it. it is much easier to promote singing shows than md shows. also, some people are just confused today trying to copy american music.
#302 – syed – my guess is that you’re being sarcastic! lata had the voice, asha had the willingness to sing every kind of song. lata had just as much ability as asha imo (even in range) but was stoic and unwilling to sing certain songs – for example she won’t sing the remix trash asha likes to do to promote herself / increase numbers. of course asha had a great voice too -but clearly not as good as lata’s. rafi had a great voice (male counterpart to lata) and great ability to sing any kind of song that respected mds provided him. he had it all. hence, rafi >>>.
#302, Syed: then I’ll consider the possibility that Asha Bhonsle (who was partly responsible for RD’s untimely demise) manipulated RD Burman in the early 90s when he was weak and made him say these things to put down Rafi. Asha Bhonsle was always second to Lata (exception of OP Nayar). Rafi & Lata were the first serve, the A team, the gold standard. She knew if anyone would beat her in ability or versatility – it was Rafi Sahab. So put down Mohammed Rafi to make him look lesser.
Asha Bhonsle’s rendering of “O Aaajaaa Aaaa Aaaajaa’ is unpleasant because I can feel the bottom of lungs – she OVERDID it in any an attempt to beat Rafi Sahab. She failed. Mohammed Rafi did it just right and if needed – he could have done more or less – as the MD wanted. When you the see wide variety of compositions Rafi has worked with (he holds record for working with maximum MDs) and all kinds of songs, and you see how he grasped the nuances of some very difficult / emotional songs, and you see that “Aaja Aaja” would be a walk in the field for Rafi.
post 303
It is a shame that the writer Raju bharatan a very senior journo resorts to some mudslinging Rafi sahab singing talent and he claims to be his biggest fan along with Latajis.
Raju claims that he cannot write a biography but has published more articles on icon Rafi sahab than on any other singer in his career. But I have read most of the articles where he revers Rafi sahab but sometimes resorts to gimmicks or so called yellow journo culture which he fails with a legend like Rafi sahab.
As u rightly pointed out if Rafi sahab is not loved by anyone following hindi music then they are plain deaf or blindly biased like Anil Biswas.
For the same Anilda ,Rafi sahab had high respect and sung some good melodies but he being Talats fav would have made such comments.
RD Burman has been misquoted by Raju and even he took Rafi sahab for 108 songs while Rafi sahabs had sung max with other famous MDs which is itself a big record.
Infact the lovers of Vintage music considers Rafi sahab and Lataji the greatest,dynamic,melodious,talented,evergreen, singers in the hindi film industry followed by Asha,kishore n mukesh.
In the music industry the vote goes to Shanker Jaikishen,SD Burman,LP,Naushad,Madan Mohan,OPN and RD burman
“If a person cannot appreciate the greatness of Rafi, then it can be safely concluded that the person does not have a sense of music. Of course, RDB was a good MD though not a great MD like Naushad, Madan Mohan, OP Nayyar, SDB, etc.” –
I am surprised that how a person who is writing an article can comment like this. It is published through internet means going the wrong message to everyone. No not about the Legend Rahul Dev Burman. I am scared about the site. Everyone knows who is Panchamda and his creations. Either the person is nonsense about the music or he is mad and sick who has comment like this. First try to understand the differences between TALENT and GENIUS. Rahul Dev is born Genius and he is a trendsetter and dynamic. With due respect to everyone India till date can’t produce a dynamic singer like Kishore Kumar and music director like Rahul Dev burman who have created and gave us the creations and magic with same pace.
I think that some of my esteemed Rafian’s are mistaken – the comments regarding Rafi Saab’s difficulty in getting the “Nuances” of aaja aaja correct were also highlighted by Aasha Bhosle in a live t.v interview which i have seen. She stated that Rafi saab just could not get the correct feeling of the song and only she done it correctly.
Ref: Post 294
Mr. Gurumurthy,
I totally agree with you. I am convinced that Mr. Raju Bharatan has misquoted RDB. RDB may have had personal liking towards KK (which he is entitled to). But it is difficult to believe that RDB did not like Rafi sahab for his singing inabilities. After all Rafi Sahab was SDB’s favourite singer!
It was a joke to read that Rafi Sahab found it difficult to grasp the nuances of RDBs tunes! Naushad Sahab, Roshan Ji, Madan Mohan Ji and other greats must be squirming in disgust.
Aaa aaja must have been a cake walk for Rafi Sahab!
Shirish Kulkarni
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