True Voice – Mohd Rafi
The following article was brought to my notice when Sharad posted it on MAS. The article has been trimmed down a bit keeping afloat Rafi details. However, anyone interested can go visit the source at http://tfmpage.com/forum/4980.6302.04.57.19.html
I am Swaminatha Iyer and I am 78 years old. I hail from Tiruchi and I am a part of music associations in Tiruchi, M’as as well as in West Bengal and Maharashtra.
I think it is wrong to condemn music or artists on either side of Vindhyas. Our Indian music is one of the few which has not been cleaned off by the western music though there has always been a influence. It speaks a lot of the richness of our music. Sometime back director of MTV had said that MTV westernized the music wherever it went but in India , MTV had to be Indianized for it to be accepted. A lot of this credit goes to the Indian film music.
I have been fortunate to have close personal association with Rafi, Sirkali, TMS, Dr. BMK, Kishore, SPB & KJY, PS, Mannadey and the one and only Lata Mangeshkar.
Comparisons are bound to come, but almost every artist or I have met considers Lata to be beyond comparison. Her talents are beyond anyone’s reach. Even Sirkazi used to talk of her singing like a die-hard fan as do countless others.
Now coming to the Rafi-SPB discussion. It might be difficult to convince an South Indian to believe Rafi is the better and at the same time Rafi crowd will never believe any other male singer comes anywhere nearer. There is one more mobile crowd, which is well conversant with Hindi and some south Indian language. Majority of them tilt to either Rafi or Kishore.
During one of my stays in M’as I had stayed with SPB. While talking of true voices he said, I don’t feel like half a singer when listening to Rafi. True voice is not a tech term but many in circle use it. Perfect example would be lata, but to understand consider our own PS who within her range is superb. People who do not have such true voices can never do justice to original. They generally underplay many parts of the song or fake it with bass/superficial singing. True voices make people like Sirkazi, Nusrat Fateh Ali khan, Lata… Inimitable. However since Sirkazi and Nusrat did not have the filmy voices their “real” following is limited to their local arena.
In addition to the true voice if the singer has a very good voice then in “most” cases he/she can better songs of others. It is this combination which makes Rafi stand out among the other male singers. There are many here who seem to have mistaken notions on a good bass and also on high pitch.
Bryan Adams does not require a monster bass in “Summer of 69” to sound real manly. It is the punch which gives that feel and that is decided only by the comfort level in most ranges (that is by what your throat can support). This you CAN never disguise with bass. Since people have talked about lack of manly voice viz. a viz. Rafi it was necessary to bring this point out. I have had the fortune of listening to most singers in studio and some times without a mike, practicing with MD’s.When Lata or Rafi do, the level is so high that people hesitate to even hum. It felt silly to sing in their presence (and it feels silly when someone says his voice isn’t manly).
In RD’s tribute when SPB sang “Aaja Aaja mein hoon” or “Chaand mera dil” it sounded only sweet and lacked punch if you compare with Rafi’s original.
Yesu once told me God has been partial to Rafi. He said “god gift term anavasyamaa romba common aa ippo use aardu”.. but idu Rafi kee thaan 100% porundu”. This person could sing “as intricately as a lady without sounding thin”, “cover any mood”, “versatility odey perfect example Rafi”. Yesu said most important is the comfort level over ranges which makes you feel God has been partial to Rafi. (But Of course in Rafi’s early career (1950’s) the voice was relatively feeble).
To people exposed to Rafi’s talent, these or any amount of praise can only seem less. I just wish he was alive and you people could get a live chance to hear him. Probably you can get hold of the DD album for the Geet Gaata Chal series where the first four episodes were dedicated to Rafi. Rafi is on camera singing “O Duniya Ke Rakwaaley” and many other songs. If you see and hear the last part you will realize why SPB said “impossible”. I think particularly those people who have talked about scales w.r.t Rafi should see this album. Its a known fact in industry that Rafi ruled high pitch and there is no male singer better in switching notes so easily. There are artists who can go beyond but then they sound strained or they don’t have pleasant voices when they venture into those territories.
Many singers of today are his compulsive followers. But they end up inheriting only part of his quality. Md. Aziz ended up with a sad voice. Mahendra Kapoor with a thick nasal voice. Anwar with a nasal voice. Sonu Nigam with a feminine voice. Rafi neither had a soft voice nor a heavy (bass) voice he had a good voice. Importantly did not strain at high notes, and voice if at all only became better at higher notes. If you see him singing it will remind you of Janaki. However diff the song is or the note is he will be smiling and singing. It is unthinkable that he cannot sing something.
There seems to be lot of talk about “Shankara Bharanamo” song. SPB has sung many a great numbers and things being said about this song in this forum are rather amusing, particularly b’cos 3 out of 4 people who can be called as singers will be able sing it and at least one out of 10 will sing it with the same effect. There are lot of other songs of SPB where this great singer has played with songs in total control. You will find most south Indian singers who have had a good exposure say that it is beneficial to learn Hindustani as it gives better breath control and improves expression.
Rafi was not only able to glide over a song, the important thing was that he could express each word/sound when singing. It is one thing to hold your breath, start and reach a crescendo (high note), as like in “Shankara”, “Anbey (Yennai kaan villaye)” it is different ballgame if you have to do it from low notes or suddenly switch notes. With practice the former can be done, latter requires a special gift. Rafi had a natural ability to do the latter. In “Tum joh mil gaye ho” there is such a transition in the “karwaan mil gaya” part. I have never seen anyone do justice to most of his songs in my life time. In “parda hai parda” quawaali the similar part is “kar doon to, Akbar mera naam”. In fact most of his songs will have these specialty as it was his natural ability to sing freely in a wide range at the same time giving that extra expression.
Whereas SPB takes us to heavens with “Idu oru pon maali”,”Ilaya nila” “bisiladarenu”(kannada), when he sings Rafi’s song it lacks the punch or expression, though it has the bass. But at least most agree that SPB does some justice to original, whereas most others murder the original.
One trivial point I would like to add is that singing in Hindi is harder. There are more “JHA”,”CHA”,”HA”,”THA”, “KHA”,”JA”,”FA”. These take away the breath faster. The more expressive you are the more air you are using up. Just singing from Nabhi will not help, your throat also needs to do a lot, for singing in Hindi, Bengali etc. SPB makes you fall in love with his south Indian songs but same cannot be said about his Hindi songs. If you just glide through words having these sounds, you will never be expressive. Doing this as well as reaching high notes is not easy. Rafi had this gift and that’s why it is difficult to imagine anyone else in his shoes. Song “Chalkaaye jaam” has so much expression that it is unthinkable how anyone can sing it. When Rafi switches to a high note with “Mitwaa” in the song “Chaahunga mein tughey” you cannot replicate it with bass. Most others will sound as if they are shouting in such cases. That man’s throat had the ability to freely sing at such levels.
Versatility is not just the ability to sing in various styles, more important is how good you are singing in those styles. You have lot of Ghazal singers today but when Rafi sings a Ghazal you will sit up and take notice. You don’t have to be part of the Ghazal listeners crowd. This is one important aspect. Whatever style you sing you should be able to pull the common man to listen and not just a particular crowd. Pick “parda hai parda” or any qawalli and it will stand tall among other qawalli’s.
Variety is amazing :
songs of Guru Dutt’s Khagaz key phool or songs like abhi naa jao chod key, Aaja teri yaad aayi, Aaj kal mein dhal gaya, Aaj kal terey merey pyaar, Aasmaan sey aaya farishta, Dil ney pyaar kiya hai, Deewana mujh saa nahi, Din dhal jaaye, Duniya paagal hai, Jaane walon jara, Dil joh na kaha saka, Dil key jharokon mein, Dil kaa bhavar, Chalkey teri aakkhon sey, Kar chaley hum fida, khilona jaan kar tum, Woh jab yaad aay, Woh hain jara khafa, Vaadian mera daaman, Pathar key sanam, Chaand mera dil, Main zindagi kaa saath, Mainey poocha chaand sey, sun sun jaalima, Koi jab raah na paay, hum to chaley pardes, badan pey sitaarey, laal chadi maidaan, Tum jo mil gaye, O meri shaahey, Sau baar janam lengey, Tum mujhey yoon bhula, Tumney mujhey dekha, Terey merey sapney, Tumny pukaara hum chaley aay
Name a situation/mood and Rafi’s song will be there on the top.
Swami
It was just one n half decade India’s freedom, that India lost a major war against china,,,the nation was mourning n frightened to think that,,,, r we that weak that we got defeated…dejection was all over,,,,then a voice came,,leaving much behind mere entertainment but became voice of nation calling its youth to be brave,,,aye mere ladlo utho himmat se kaam lo,,,,,,,,,,and other was fire in itself,,if anyone want to admit— admit if not get lost,,,,,,but the fact is this song worked to revive national pride and respect for national army that how brave they are,,,,,though our soldiers died but came voice from every corner of India saying,, Ҡzinda rehne ke mausham bahut hain magar,,,jaan dene ki rut roj aati nahi,,,husn aur ishq dono ko rushwa kade wo jawani jo khoon me nahati nahi,,ajj dharti bani dulhan saathiyon,,kad chale ham fidaâ€â€â€â€¦â€¦well, was it just lyrics,,,no,,,,in every kavi sammelen or mushirya, we listen very good poetry after which we say wah,,,but forgets after few moments or days,,, there r countless poetry on nation,,but with this song,,,rafi sahab`s heroic voice was the soul of the song that enlightened body of the words with reviving strenghth……Rafi is not just entertainment!!!!! And rafians are not just fans,,,they are rather Rafi lover…
Again, and again, and again!
KKfan at post no.1886 says “i.e compare hindi film with hindi film only as with others comparison was not purely possible due to stream differences (in the case of the long debate between shri ghantasala, another greatest talent from the south in playback singing & rafi earlier) OK now the debate stopped. And when now comparisons with hindi singers are made (lata, kishore etc.)”
Are you really sure that you will stick with these yardsticks. If yes, can you show ur lengthy arguments favoring Shri Ghantasalaji and Lataji as way better singers than KK at yoodleeyoo.com If there are not such posts there, then go and first prove there that this fact. If you are interested more in truth than in idols, why the heck don’t u go there and prove it to all the KK fans that KK is not at all the better singer than Ghantasala.
Is it not really hypocrisy that a KK fan uses other great singers and posts on Rafi web-site to just show that Rafiji is not the best singer? So, Mr.KK fan, are you a rationalist or a hypocrite 😀
1897 – abhishek ji.
Good post and I appreciate it. Comparisons are always fine if they are on constructive angles and such healthy comparison also gives true music lovers to acquaint about a particular artist. Even in this beautiful site, discussions had been healthy, but for some members who created ……….. That is fine, as every community has such kind of people. So this great site is also no exception to that and despite such issues, it is proved that this site can successfully sail through all such challenges.
Even in other forums such as orkut etc. unhealthy discussions are figuring in including calling off names etc. This has become the practise of the day. On the other day, i had been to one RMIM blog for comparison between two great playback singers and barring one or two posts, other discussions have been quite healthy. Even some rafi fans from this site are participants in that and what a knowledge sharing really, there was no dispute. The conclusion was peaceful and healthy. This should serve as an example when discussions are taking place between two artists. Following is the link of the RMIM blog which I referred here for interested music lovers.
groups.google.com/group/rec.music…/9df5ba648d40fcdc
dear all,
i dont get it y ppl dont understand tht this site is called “mohdrafi.com” so very obviously this is dedicated to greatest singer of all times.. y wud anyone who does not like him wud wanna come here and write bad things abt him and expect his fans to appreciate it, unless the topic is rafi vs someone such comments only increase the workload of the srver. for debate there r many other sites whr these so called other singer fans could go n write their “thoughts”.
anyways yesterday while surfing the net i was unfortunate to come across a site called “satyansh.com” (i think he is the same guy who used to write here but was bumped off by rafi fans). he is the super moderator of that site and is complaining tht we consider rafisaab as god on this site and i was like wht else do u expect? also he was only one who was posting on that site hmm quite obsessed with himself…
lastly if anyone wants to argue abt rafi vs any other singer im pretty open to it i used to do that a lot on orkut in kishore kumar community. eventually the topic was deleted by kishore fans when they started to lose their ground in their home turf …………
serious note to rafi lovers:
band of these Kishore fans are very shrewd but mis-directed & strategically working to create dispute over here,,,,
they started their stupid talk misinterpreting our tremendous respect of Rafi sahab as a singer and as a saintly person,or as a icon of huminity or nation,,,, they revoltingly started saying that Rafi lovers making rafi sahab “idolically a personal god”,,,this is a point that in Islam not acceptable,,,,,and has some controversy in Christainity as well,,,,n they raised same question in context of hinduism ,,this is disgusting on their part!!!!!
as they couldn`t be successful on this point they raised few other points
by making hate community,,,first,,,they started portraiting that Rafi fans don`t respect sonu nigham,,then,,they fetched the name of Shehgal sahab, Talat mehmood ji,,mukeshji,etc to compare Rafi sahab,,they took,,asha bhoshle out of context from our posts,,,forcefully brought Lataji in the comparision,,,no one even commented in their context of Ghantashalaji,,yet they repetitively kept on making their name as a conflict creation and continuasly using the term, hindi film and south india,,,not as a integral India,,,they started making difference between Rafi fans as well call few of us sane minded and other insane(following Binu nair sir`s post of Integral rafi parivar),,,and about Kishore kumar,they had created “shor”,do we hate kishore kumar,,,,,why should we hate anyone,,,,,,we never give even adamn seriousness to them to these shors ,as for us they can never be compared to the singing greatness or personality of our Beloved Rafi sahab as we have reached final destination of music in Rafi sahab`s divine voice,,yet,,,they neglecting our continous requests and condemns ,,,making statements artistically as how good they r and how much they respect us,,but in fact provoking us to make harsh words…….
welcome back KK fan jest i want say that you are not going to win because no one can change the truth,Lata Ji was great singer and her sister also but also we have many other great female singers that is truth if you agree or not but when ever we speak about the malet here is only one and that is Mohd rafi.
jest I want ask you if you can answer,Do you know who is mannay Dey?Do you know who is Naushand,Madan Mohan,Shammi Kapoor and Op Nayar?
please listen to the songs which mohd rafi sang for Rajesh Khanna,Raj Kapoor,Dev Anand and Manoj Kummar
Savitaaji, you are amazing. Keep it up. The way you have described the ‘adayen’ of rafi sahab in your post 1892 goes to show how closely you listen to music and your knowledge is supreme.
since,,,its most unfortunate but the way of mundane world that our Rafi sahab is not with us in physical form but “”aaj bhi rafi zinda hai.,,,,his immortal voice is ever present with us,,,,,,and as a companion as a swettest friend whos always present with us in every mood of ours and who`s personality is always inspiring us every moment to lead a better life and to be a better human being,,,,,,,,how great it would be if we through this forum know few more details about our beloved rafi sahab and discover some of his priceless gems that we couldn`t listen yet,then to waste our time in discussing how great Rafi sahab is to someone who is present here with eyes and ears closed!!!!!,,,,,,
post 1887 Kishorfanji with all respect,,,Its surly a public forum,open debates are always welcome here but senseless debates are never welcome here or anywhere..
,u urself know that singer that u mentioned is really one of most honoured one but is not that versatile as rafi sahab and her song has lesser impact than rafi sahab song`s,listen to any genre,eg,<>suku suku,,afoo khuda,,,<>Ham bekhudi me tum ko,sun le tu dil ki sada,Badan pe sitare lapete huey,Chehra tera allah allah,Aye Gulbadan,etc.,,<,,yeh desh hai veer jawano ka,mere desh me pawan chale(the way this song starts hurrrr hahoo and carries melody and national pride),<>like madhuban me Radhika,nache man mora magan tigda dhigi dhigi,<>,Ham kale hain to kya hua,,Jat yamla pagla,<>,Shirdi waale,and prda hai parda>>,,,<> Yeh duniya agar mil bhi jaye of pyasha,,o duniya ke rakhwale,etc.<mujhe duniya walo ,hai duniya usi ki etc.,,list goes countless,U can`t imagine lata ji in that many moods,,but everyone know how easliy Rafi sahab could sing that song yaara sili sili,,and Biti na bitai raina,,,(lata ji`s national award song) but how tough is aaaaaaaaaaajjaaa aaja tujhko pukare,babul ki duaye and flat note Kya hua tera waada,,,
.the way u used Rev. Lata mangeshkar`s name with suffix of bharat ratna,,it doesn`t show ur respect for the award or for the singer rather a egoistic approch to show that she holds award, thats status wise bigger than padam shree of rafi sahab,,,,yes everyone over here admit it! hence,we say “”its unfair”” and panel too blind to recognise Rafi sahab as they don`t trust their ear!!! Anyway,,, as far as award is concerned,,,,I can`t remember Dilip sahab(of so many film fare award)with any national award other than that NTR national life time achievement but shaif ali khan hold national award for best actor….of all the award Noble prize is concerned biggest in our time,,,,,Swami Vivekanda,first recognized Global celebrity in modern history never got that award but Frederic Passy got noble prize of peace in 1901,,,,,if a person know a little about modern physics know about Boson,,the boson`s name is derived from satyandra bose of India,bose worked evenly for einstien e=mc^2, but Boson concept won two noble prize but none given to Mr bose,,,,whats need to go so far,,Gandhi ji never Got noble prize for peace however nelson Mandela working on gandhi philosophy got one…..!!!!!So stop making award story,,,,,as rafi sahab already have many awards,,,soooner or later he should have even bharat ratna also,,if not than who cares!
Anonymousji:
This gentleman (or lady) is what we call ‘a troll’ in orkut. They come up with what is seemingly logical or innocent comments which are actually designed to provoke and disrupt the flow of things. What we can do is to simply ignore them, thus denyng them what they ar looking for.l
Post 1886: Mohammed Rafi Saheb is more than Bharat Ratna.
hi kishorefan: imo, you are arguing only for the sake of arguing. i agree with respecting other artists etc. but the other stuff you talk about (rafi fans request apples & oranges etc) are just misconstrued references on your part for the sake of an argument. such things are a waste of time (only my opinion). i will not take part in it as it is a waste of precious life. That time is better spent listening to “Matlabi Hain Log Yaha” or “Jaane Walon Zara”.
dear kfan ,why you waste your time and your intelligence? on this site,please be guided by the words of many rafi fans or take the next train to AGRA OR RANCHI – PLEASE SEND THE ADDRESS WHERE TICKET CAN BE SEND TO YOU
savitaa ji,
First, rafi fans request to other fans was do not compare apples with oranges i.e compare hindi film with hindi film only as with others comparison was not purely possible due to stream differences (in the case of the long debate between shri ghantasala, another greatest talent from the south in playback singing & rafi earlier) OK now the debate stopped. And when now comparisons with hindi singers are made (lata, kishore etc.) again rafi fans say do not compare with rafi again. Rafi fans can write anything but when others write something the problem starts. If this is not a public forum, then request can be made openly that only messages supporting rafi will be allowed. If this is a public forum, open debates must be allowed and no body should be asked to quit. Calling it a public forum and asking others to quit is clear discrimination as all people writing here has equal right to post messages.
Savitaa ji,
Lata mangeshkar is bharat ratna and regarded as equally the greatest among female playback singers. (no offense to other female playback singers – they are too great in their own way) popularity wise – lata is greater. Talent each singer has his own speciality.
Ab bhi Zinda hai rafi””””,, thanx unlimited for such a nice words! plz everyone share such nice words,,,as many like me have felt Rafi sahab but don`t have wit to express this feeling,,,however such a poetry and those rendered by naushad saab,,or ravi ji,,,are very close to express Rafi sahab!
आज à¤à¥€ जिंदा है रफी
Among the many verses written in praise of Rafi Sahab by eminent poets over the last several decades, here is one by Qamar Jalalabadi, which conveys an entire meaning to what Music is and how Rafi Sahab was the complete embodiment of Music. This is how it goes……..
देश के लाखों जवानों की तमनà¥à¤¨à¤¾ है रफी,
ज़खà¥à¤®-इ-दिल के लिठखà¥à¤µà¤¾à¤¬à¥‹à¤‚ का मसीहा है रफी,
इसके नगमों ने जगाये हैं हजारों जज़à¥à¤¬à¤¾à¤¤,
सिरà¥à¤« नगमा नहीं, नगà¥à¤®à¤¾à¤¤ की दà¥à¤¨à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ है रफी,
इसके गीतों के है दीवाने ज़माने में सà¤à¥€,
जितने फनकार हैं इन सबमे में अनोखा है रफी,
मैंने पूछा के कलाकार हमारा है कहाà¤,
इसके नगमों ने कहा “आज à¤à¥€ जिंदा हैं रफी”.
well, its two sick virus,,,,as virus are those who disturb smooth functioning of a program,,,,,,similarly there are many who don`t even bother to understand us ,,,but start giving lectures!!!!
meen,,,ref,1881,,,from where the hell,u have brought forcibly Lata mangeshkar in the discussion,,forget the word drag,,,no one was talking over here about ur so called humanbeing,go through the recent posts,,,,,,,,,,don`t u know spammers are not allowed here or in any respectable website,,,on eternal rafi dot com,,Mr Binu Nair(sir) and abhis has already replyed u,,,we already have to sick virus over here on other posts,,,,who r here to give us lecture,,,like the song of Rafi sahab<>>>common u haters!!! go away for the heaven sake!
Don’t drag LATA MANGESHKAR in this kind of discussions !!!
She is beyind comparision. Eventhough jelous people do mud slinging on her but they too know in their heart that she is greatest and Nature’s uneque creation.
People do not spare GOD ; she is humanbeing after all !
yes wellsaid unknown,,only something that is eternal and divine is forever,,and everything else dies out,,however,,,with music Binu sir,,perhaps used our context of Rafi sahab and other film actors for whom Rafi sahab gave playback,,,,in this statement he is 100% correct!
YEH RAFI GHARANA HAI……………….
LET ME GREET RAFI LOVERS FROM ALL PART OF THE WORLD WHO FORM THE EXTENDED RAFI PARIVAR.
WE ALL HAVE OUR DIFFERENCES AND VIEWPOINTS ON VARIOUS SUBJECTS DISCUSSED HEREIN AND IN EVERYDAY LIFE.
but, there is agreement on one major point. and that’s mohd rafi is the eternal and the best singer of all times. rafi has the biggest following among singers and he is one of the greatest human being – ever born. (sorry if someone would got jealous of this).
my greatest regards / respects to this website for serving as a platform for healthy discussions to rafi parivar members – the world over.
my greetings to painstaking contributors like raju korti, the bijoors, sandeep sir, savitaa garcia, suhana safar and all my great friends and contributors herein for keeping the rafi parivarik “ties” healthy and memorable on this site.
binu nair, rafi foundation, mumbai.
binus2000@hotmail.com
Sir Binu Nair
I don’t agree with you “that the music and the singers will have a long life than the heroes”because there are many singers who came and gone,
1.who can be better than SJ in music world?
2.D Kummar switched to KK in 1970’s but no one able to give him the magic as Mohd Rafi did…..
Dear singh ji, – 1873
Nice reading of your post and nice information on tms & ghantasala and their relationship. True, ghantasala was dominant in tamil in 50’s (the suvarna sundari number in 1957 – kuhu kuhu by rafi & lata in hindi was sung in tamil by ghantasala & suseela, though telugu number is the original one first sung by ghantasala and jikki). True, Ghantasala introduced tms to tamil producers and tms was another singer, next to ghantasala, the tamil film world has got. tms was popoularly known as ghantasala of tamil in those days and he rendered many good songs on evergreen heroes of tamil world as you said M G Ramachandran & Sivaji Ganesan. Nevertheless, ghantasala continued in tamil until 1972 (of course with reduction in his tamil numbers as he concentrated more on telugu film world) and his last song in tamil was muttaih muttaga sattiah ….. a great emotional song in tamil, (which brings tears even today) music directed by K V Mahadevan, who specifically invited & preferred only ghantasala for singing this song in tamil and incidentally which was the last song of ghantasala in tamil. Thanks for the post and bringing back the memories of those times.
Dear Binu nair ji, – post 1876
Is it true that dilip kumar has done that way. It is very sad and regrettable issue indeed. The famous classical song – madhuban me radhika naache re (what a musical composition) and many other great songs rafi ji had sung for dilip kumar were, of course, one of the main causes for furthering the career of dilip kumar. Praising the nightingale, how the nightingale has furthered his career, i do not know. And rafi ji’s remark was right when he had said, you as well sing on the stage as you are a big hero. Well said comment and fitting one. And rafi ji compromising on naushad ji’s interference, very great ; this shows the generosity of rafi ji in maintaining the required decency and respect towards other artists, specially in public programmes such as concerts. This is the true characteristic of a great artist such as rafi ji.
And I do not think that lata ji had surpassed rafi ji in any way. I personally feel and think that rafi ji was the numero one in hindi film world and it is difficult to find a singer like him in hindi film world.
Rest said, as singh ji, says in post 1873, dilip kumar is not remembered like rafi ji today, so there is no issue at all even if rafi sahab is praised by dilip kumar or not.
Well said singh saaheb (Post 1873)……..
the music and the singers will have a long life than the heroes. i have seen dilip kumar, a very egoistic person always coming on public platforms and eugolising about the nightingale.
in turn, the lady also used to talk big things about dilip saaheb. it had become a farcical public display of : ” i scratch your back, you scratch mine” policy.
dilip saaheb never did acknowledge the role of rafi in furthering his career. he had to switch to kishore kumar in sagina mahato – when rafi refused to sing for dilip kumar after dilip kumar sidelined rafi and played the hero’s part at a concert show – down south.
mohd rafi had then reportedly remarked : you are a big hero, you as well sing on the stage.
infact, rafi had decided that he would not sing at the venue and only naushad saahebs intervention prevailed upon him to sing – that day at the concert and save the day for dilip kumar.
needless, to say the song of sagina mahato with the joint effort of dilip kumar-kishor kumar-sachin dev burman backed by a section of the bengali brigade
turned out to be a colossus failure – never to be repeated again, even at the peak of kishore kumars career.
yes. dilip kumar will never say great things of mohd rafi – publicly. others will do – and the world will listen and agree.
binu nair, rafi foundation, mumbai
Chanced upon this live ‘na kisi ki aankh ka noor….’ and sharing it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLM-Wvky7Gg
Singhji:
TMS was there to carry the mortal remains of Ghantasalaji! What a grand gesture by him…
Dear Rafi Lovers,
It is the ego factor which comes in between. Many actors have been benefitted by rafi ji’s voice, but many also think that it is due to their talent they have achieved recognition, forgetting that music plays a great role in films specially for moulding career of film heroes. However, even if they do not appreciate such factor, no difference is going to be made, as people will continue to listen to songs for a longer time than viewing the film and the heroes. The music has a longer say and influence and so does rafi ji. All people very well remember how many people had turned up for rafi ji’s last journey even when it was raining in 1980, with umbrellas over their head and some even battling rain. We very well know that people continue to remember and embrace great rafi ji numbers even today than the so called heroes of yester years. The charm of rafi ji is more than them and shall continue.
As Sri ahmed kutty ji, says sounderrajan, today has no recognition, who was once upon a revered singer in tamil in 60’s . People have forgotten this revered singer from tamil who have rendered some good numbers for MGR & Sivaji ganesan. Nevertheless, even today his songs are popular as good old numbers in tamil with many secret followers of this singer in tamil.
Great artists have such critics (who in outward appearance appreciate the artists but inside have ego problems), Another notable case, was when the telugu great singer ghantasala passed away, it was a surprise that the two top evergreen heroes of the telugu film industry at that time (I need not mention the names of the heroes as people know them) did not pay a visit to his funeral but only made some great emotional speeches on all india radio. (when right from Balamuralikrishna the great carnatic artist, to small music directors in south paid a visit to the great singer) It was a well known fact that the great singer was the voice for more than quarter of a century for the two evergreen heroes and who was instrumental in moulding their careers. And true artist great hall mark of respect was from none other than t m sounderrajan of tamil who carrried the last mortal remains of sri ghantasala as he was the one who introduced t m sounderrajan to tamil producers in tamil film world. T m sounderrajan remembered this and paid gratitude to him on his last journey.
So, nothing makes much difference even if the people benefitted by them do not gratify them today, rather the influential factor which the great singers have cast upon the masses continues to wave the magic influence of those greats in hearts of millions of people even today.
Post 1871 : SAVITAA JI :
THERE IS A point about your point on our dharam saaheb which could be true about the sholay song.
but what about the “mai jat yamla pagla diwana song” which was recorded for pratigya a movie made by mr ajit deol , dharam’s brother during the 1978 period.
i had attended the concert at shanmukhanda hall and even though the movie was “not” released, mohd rafi saaheb sang the number and may i say that the number floored the 2800 audience at the hall. the number still reverberates in my mind and when the movie was released – it was a super hit.
yes. i met dharam ji two weeks back at his juhu abode – and all along the meeting he was singing praise about mohd rafi saaheb. he was also talking about his songs by mohd rafi saaheb in many movies and was humming the eternal shola aur shabnam number : jeet hi lenge baazi hum tum, khel yeh choote na,…. pyar ka bandhan.
in the industry , shammi kapoor and dharam ji are the greatest supporters of
mohd rafi and very soon i will shoot them on video – talking about mohd rafi – god’s very own singer – at the soonest.
binu nair, mumbai
yes 1868,,,person like Rafi sahab is everyone`s friend but people because of their own ego and jelousy maintained differences with him and tried to put hurdles,,,,,,but its amazing Rafi sahab`s range is infinite everywhere he is compared and envy comes to sick minds,,,,,anyway,,,Dharmendra,,,,,why wouldn`t he be Rafi sahab`s greatest admire,,,,when dharmendra started his career,,,Rafi sahab`s voice made him a decent star,,,,but when dharmendra was star greater than Amitabh bachhan in sholey,,why Big B,,,Dharmendra was biggest star of that movie sholey,,,if he would have said just once that he want Rafi sahab`s voice,,,could Rd burman deny,,,but who the hell care!!!,,,,,,but its the fact who left rafi saab,,,left success,,,,,so is Dharmendra,,,,but when dharmendra lost stardom,,rafi sahab once again,,,gave him timeless hits including that Jat yamla pagla song that is Dharmendra identity these days,,,,,but,,,,,,,there is a Rafi sahab`s punjabi song,,,,”matlab di ye duniya yaaro”””””,,,lets listen to that!!!! ,,,
ref 1868,1867,,no matter if Dilip kumar make any statement or not,,,,,he can never escape himself,,,,,,,who can forget,,,what a great musical DISASTER Shagina was for both Dilip Kumar and Sd burman withstanding great lyrics of Sahir ludhianvi,,,its an observed fact those who left Md Rafi couldn`t make come back,,,why the golden era of music directors of 50s and 60s ended in 70s as they felt(most of them) that their success has nothing to do with rafi sahab,,,so tried experimenting thats good but “whats the need of experimenting,humours, ar rehman, “when u have best of bests as Mohd Rafi”.Even Rd burman had to get back to Rafi after consequitive success of LP… The story was different in 50s n 60 when Dilip Saheb was super star,,,everyone was amazed with songs of dilip kumar film,,,,as dilip saheb acted very naturally with no animation of expression,,,and hence Rafi sahab also used to sing so naturally that even adherent Rafi fan when sees ganga jamuna forgets that any playback is going on when nain lad jayihen and other songs are going on.Rafi sahab so subtle with divinity that he dilutes completly in context of song,,,and dilip kumar becomes super human with such a extraordinary voice,,,,,this was the case of every Dilip kumar film where Rafi sahab always excels the realm of normal human`s emotional range till merges in infinity,,,,,but Naushad sahab was recorded condeming this statement in 60s where he says,”what rubbish Rafi sahab is greatest everywhere irrespective of if its Dilip kumar movie or not”,,,thats a fact,,,Rafi sahab can sing in every raaga,,,all kind of songs with different voice for different singers,,but when Aadmi released,,,,,talks broke all barrier everywhere as a question raised that if Dilip kumar did justice to Rafi sahab`s voice,,,,than finally Dilip sahab talked publicly saying that when Rafi sahab gives playback I need not to act,I relax then,,as song does part of emotion”,,,,however,,,,,,this statement shows dilip kumar`s understanding of music as when he almost always insisted for Rafi voice and all the three sahab`s of that era including naushad sahab worked togather yet its “stranger than strange”,,why he keeps mum over praisng Rafi sahab,as who other than he himself knows what does Rafi sahab`s voice mean to his career,,,,perhaps he want to avoid forgotton talk to come again,,and to remain sustain with his throne of tragic king!
thank you very much savithaji for your comments.”aaj
puraani rahonse….” it is one of my favourites.i believe
it is one of the perfect and immortal songs of indian film
music.the sweetness in the sad song – the high pitch and
and the hooo hooo humming.who can forget this song.
i do not understand people who are telling about others
and forgetting about rafi saab.as i told in one of my previous
comments, as far as talent is concerned even lataji is inferior
to rafi saab.who ever the actress lataji had nothing to do
with the style of the actress.in the other hand the talent
of rafi saab had seen for various actors starting from shammi
kapoor to johny walker.in tamil movies of m.g.r. and shivaji
ganeshan,the singer t.m.saunder rajan had an ability to sing
separate style of singing for both m.g.r. and shivaji ganeshan.
compared to that we can see how able rafi saab to give
separate style for devanand,rajendra kumar,shammi kapoor,
dilip kumar,dharmender,johnny walker,junior mehmood etc.
Well said Mr Binu Nair, ref post 1867 where you have asked Dilip Kumar to acknowledge the great help rendered by Rafi Saab to make him to what he is today. I also feel sad when all these gentlemen who were the benificiaries of the great voice of Rafi Saab ignore him after his death.I read that Mrs Rafi before her death said that the only two actors who were close to Rafi Saab were Shammi Kapoor and Dharmendra.Dilip Kumar can praise Lata Mangeshkar for the great singer she is.No one disputes her greatness.But she is a shrewd person who knows how to market hereself and have the limelight on hereself and always get the best deal for herself.Rafi Saab on the other hand was a humble and simple person.I wish the actors who used his voice to rise to great heights would acknowledge the great contribution of Rafi Saab in moulding their careers.Only Shammi Kapoor has said that whatever he is today,it is due to Rafi Saab.
dilip kumar saaheb : aap baar baar lata didi ka taarif karte rehte hai; kabhi ek baar to yeh kaho ke mohd rafi saaheb ne aap ke career badhane me bada kaam kiya hai.
sabhi actors yeh maana hai par aap hai jo public me kuch bhi rafi saaheb ke baare me nahi kehte hai.
binu nair.
binu bhai
i dont have this song, if i ever get it, you will be the first to have it. Do you need any other song?
AHAMED KUTTY,I being a Rafian,thanking deeply from heart for such a nice sharing!And admi reference is great indeed,,this movie has remarkable reference as from this movie a new debate started that who among Rafi shab and Dilip kumar is greater tragic king,,,,,,for all the song that rafi sahab sand was from heaven itself with great variation and different in raaga and emotion though three of them was sad number,,,later Naushad and Dilip sahab himslef achknoledged Rafi sahab to be greatest of greatest,,,,,,,,,,,,,,who can forget,,,,Aaj purani raho me koi mujhe awaj na de…with the prefix of Ho Ho Ho!!!!!……..tears the sky into pieces!
Rafi Lovers : Suhana Safar & Savitha ji : (re Post 1858 ) :- the song “meri sapnon ki rani kab aayegi tu” is a rare collection. I am dying to hear it and i would give anything to hear it.
Few Rafi lovers have claimed they “have” the song. more, they even sent it to me via net but i have “not” received it. they were only “bluffing” i feel now as even the customary phone calls now have stopped.
binu nair, mumbai…..
dear rafians,
i want to share two comments which i have recently heard.
one comment by Mannada on rafi saab in a programme of
f m rainbow banglore where he was telling about rafi saab-
that the singing style of rafi saab.he could be happy atleast
to reach half what rafi saab achieved.(the interview was
recorded two years back and retelecasted on his birth day
and the anchor was ms.snigdha)
the second comment was made by mr.jerry amaldev who was
a music director of malayalam films of yester years.he told that
once he was the assistant for noushad saab.according to him
rafi saab had a smiling face while recording the song “na aadmee
ka koee barosa” for the film “aadmee”.it is unbelievable to
have a smile in the face and sing a sad song.he was also narrating
how simple rafi saab was.(jerry amaldev’s songs were superhits
in the malayalam film “manjil virinja pookkal” and the above
comments he had made while participating a musical programme
in “doora darsan malayalam)
I thank you on behalf on Binu and others for your comments suhana bhai.
It’s good to see you here. Please share some more information if you have.
Thanks
Suhana safar ji
what a pleasure to have you here. Guys and gals, he is one of the mightiest Rafi fans who has tremendous know how about singing and HFM.
I have read great articles by him in various forums where he has listed many incidents about Rafi.
I suggest we take this opportunity to ask him questions and request him to write an article here
post 1855
Suhanaji… You have very rightly echoed the sentiments of millions of Rafi devotees all over the world. What we appreciate is a Dil Se comment on the Lord of Playback Singers… Rafi Sahab
Narayan
Baar Baar Rafi Fan Club
Bangalore
Mob 09886779557
Binu ji, how can we have that song of Rafi sahab publicly! isn`t it uploaded anywhere?,,recently I heard few song of Rafi sahab in concert uploaded recently on youtube,,tere galiyon me,na kisi ki aankh ka noor,mere mehboob etc,,,,,,really Mesmerizingly genius! I can`t understand what happens to Rafi sahab in concert,,what a feeling,,,yaa its a divine voice,,,but concert songs are in killer voice,,,goes deepest inside the heart,,what a dedication this man has even in singing publicly!plz let us taste one more flavour of this divine nector,,,,we are indebted for any of Rafi Sahab`s song! we will be even more indebted by this song of aradhana! thank you
Post 1852 and post 1855…….
a….A correction herein. The programme – a musical nite which rafi saaheb attended at the famed mumbai’s shanmukhananda hall was : a kalyanji-anandji nite. kishore kumar was the star singer.
the audience noted that mohd rafi was seated in one of the back rows. when this was brought to the notice of k & a, the music duo immediately invited rafi ji to the stage saying : “aap ka jagah to idhar hai”.
Kishore Kumar requested mohd rafi to sing any of his song. in turn, mohd rafi too asked kk to sing any one of his song.
mohd rafi ‘s turn was first. he sang : “meri sapnon ke rani kab aayegi tu” and the crowd needless to say – jumped in joy.
this anecdote was reported by mohd rafi lover from mumbai mr.shabbir jetpurwala, a big collector of mohd rafi songs.
binu nair, mumbai…
Mr. cherian,
thanks a lot for listening to the songs. rafi -salil combo has 25 songs together (correct me if i am wrong) and i have posted 24 of them. the remaining song is not a full song, only a couple of lines and i was unable to find it anywhere. May be someone could write an article on this ‘often-misinterpreted’ combo as salil always maintained that rafi was the best (like op nayyar who never used lata but said that she was the best).
ref post – 1852, binu ji,
please refer my post no -8 in the article ‘ combination of rafi sahab with shankar- jaikishan & Mehmood ‘
there what I presumed about rafi sahab’s rendition for the song ‘ mere sapnon ki rani ‘ is exactly what you had witnessed personally during rafi sahab’s concert as you wrote.
that is rafi sahab & we can never never never get atleast one substitute in this entire world for this great ‘ farishta ‘
here i can give a small example, which ever photograph of rafi sahab we see we find him smiling, & that devine smile is enough to make our day.
Binu Nair ji
I need to congratulate you and other Rafians for doing a remarkable job in communicating to others the unmatched greatness of the empereor of singing, Rafisaab.
No one will ever come and no one has ever come with the singing skills of Rafisaab coupled with his great, noble, kind an innocent character. Truly a God gifted person to get both these gifts.
Even the father of playback singing, KL Saigal conceded that Rafisaab would acheive success that no one could dream. If he was alive he would have accepted without any hesitation that his student, Rafisaab excelled KL Saigal himself and made a benchmark that probably can never be equaled.
Rafisaab is beyond any comparison or needs any testimony to prove his supremacy. All singers before, during and after him look upon him as the Guru, the master, the leader and the Emperor of singing.
All one needs is a normal pair of ears to know what a moumental miracle was the one and only Mohammed Rafi.
Thanks
SS
I can’t thank you enough, Toufique bhai for the links- the latest one as well as the previous ones.
Salilda is one MD who utilised Rafisahab’s prowess in the lower notes well. Wish this team (Salilda-Rafisahab) worked together more often.
Rafians,
Here are a few more Rafi-salil songs. I can assure you that these songs are pretty rare. I guess you need to download them from esnips to listen:
http://www.esnips.com/doc/0cb5d39f-c951-4d50-ac40-5db5e59a9cb2/sanam-tu-chal-diya–maaya
http://www.esnips.com/doc/51752e8b-51ae-433e-9e7d-ab191dc7b03e/suno-seetaa-ki-kahani—biraj-bahu
http://www.esnips.com/doc/2129421c-a850-497a-b832-c17de8ec7a60/tere-nainone-jadu-dala—taangewaali
http://www.esnips.com/doc/48918694-2826-4897-8466-9b08f65a44cb/ab-jang-shuru-kal-se-netaju-subhaschandra-bose
http://www.esnips.com/doc/daba92fc-709b-4a43-ac66-ec1557b1d876/dekho-taangaa-mera-nirala–taangewaali
http://www.esnips.com/doc/28d21c2c-06f0-4a45-8187-997b6955b454/dushmano-sabdhan–netaju-subhaschandra-bose
http://www.esnips.com/doc/7ee5aeaf-ea5f-4ec4-9076-f89fda2f4030/lo-bhor-hui-panchi—aawaz
http://www.esnips.com/doc/14451218-ca4f-46c2-9745-8ddf19d16b65/naiyaa-kameri-tuhi—-zamaana
Savita Garcia: Thanks for the Great Write-up on our divine singer – mohd rafi saaheb.
mohd rafi is the king of singing and humanity – too. we dont have to prove “this” to anyone. there is no use showing sunshine to a blind person whose mind is “closed” to thinking that there is anything like the sun.
about aradhana, i wish to clarify. late shakti samanta the producer of aradhana told me that since mohd rafi was on a foreign tour, he wanted to go ahead with the recording . he requested s.d. burman to take the services of KK for the two solo songs in aradhana.
the first recorded song was the duet during the day of “mahurat”. all the male songs were supposed to be sung by mohd rafi and this was a condition inked by the distributors – who would buy the film and finance the film. since mohd rafi was not available, KK was used.
more, in a live programme at shanmukhananda, a kishore kumar nite, mohd rafi was present. and, on public demand he rafi saaheb sung : Mere sapnon ki raani, kab aayegi tu…………….and the crowd went berseck.
binu nair, mumbai. binus2000@hotmail.com
dear all…. No body on this earth can become another mohd rafi.
to become another mohd rafi, one has to have two qualities. first is the gayaki and second is the “kindness of the heart”.
there are many mohd rafi “clones” all around but not one will ever come anywhere nearer to the great man is my strong belief.
binu nair……mumbai, binus2000@hotmail.com