Did R.D.Burman really preferred KK over Rafi?
This article is written by Mr.H.V.Guru Murthy.
A regular browser to web site mohdrafi.com, having gone through the letters of Rafi lovers would assume that R D Burman did not utilize Rafi properly, instead he preferred Kishore Kumar. Because of this reason, Rafi Fans are still upset with RDB even though he passed away a decade back.
Yes, it is true that RDB preferred KK over Rafi during early seventies. For that matter, which Music Director or Actor or Producer or Director will not have his preference. It was well known that Raj Kapoor always preferred Mukesh, Manoj Kumar preferred Mukesh or Mahendra Kapoor, B.R.Chopra films had Mahendra, MD Ravi also had plenty of songs with Mahendra so also O.P after he broke with Rafi. Similarly OP always had either Asha or Geetha Dutt and never Lata. Salil also used all other Singers. Director Subba Rao insisted on Mukesh for SAATHI even though the hero was Rajendra Kumar and MD Naushad, two Rafi Fans. Even Kalyanji Anandji had many films with Mahendra Kapoor, Mukesh and KK even though Rafi was instrumental in their raise through JAB JAB PHOOL KHILE, AAMNE SAAMNE, etc. LP, by all means Rafi Bhakts, used KK regularly in the early seventies even for Rafi heroes like Jeetendra, Dharmendra, etc. SJ also switched over to KK in movies like MAIN SUNDAR HOON, DIL DAULAT DUNIYA, KAL AAJ AUR KAL, etc. Of course, the music standard came down a notch or two in that period. But, well, it is their prerogative to have whomsoever they wanted though I am sure in heart of heart, why even openly, they would have admitted the superiority of Rafi over all other Singers. Similarly, RDB also used KK for almost all his movies in the early seventies as perhaps he had some special chemistry with him.
However, let us not forget that RDB used Rafi extensively during late sixties as his main playback singer right from the first movie. He gave hit music with Rafi in TEESRI MANZIL, NAQLI NAWAAB, CARAVAN, PYAAR KA MAUSAM, THE TRAIN, ABHILASHA, ADHIKAR, RATON KA RAAJA, etc. Later during late seventies he returned to Rafi and gave hits like SHAAN, HUM KISISE KUM NAHIN, ABDULLAH, ZAMANE KO DIKHANA HAI, etc. In between, he had Rafi in CHANDI SONA qawali with Mannadey (Ek Shok Hasina Se), YADON KI BAARAT (Title song and who can forget the duet with Asha Chura Liya Hai Tumne), DIL KA BAADSHAH (this Raj Kumar starrer had all songs by Rafi), THE GREAT GAMBLER (Raftasa Mera Naam), SHEHZADA (Solo Tere Attaroo and duet with Lata Kaahe Ko Bulaya), etc.
If a person cannot appreciate the greatness of Rafi, then it can be safely concluded that the person does not have a sense of music. Of course, RDB was a good MD though not a great MD like Naushad, Madan Mohan, OP Nayyar, SDB, etc. RD would have definitely known the great qualities of Rafi, the Singer. Just because he did not use Rafi extensively as one would expect, let us not degrade this MD who gave us some good songs in CHANDAN KA PALNA, PADOSAN, HARE RAMA HARE KRISHNA, MERE JEEVAN SAATHI, AJNABEE, AMAR PREM, SANAM TERI KASAM, BHOOT BANGLA, BAHARON KE SAPNE (Rafi solo Zamane Ne Maare), PARICHAY, KINAARA, APNA DESH, ZAHREELA INSAAN, RAMPUR KA LAKSHAMAN (Pyaar Ka Samay with Lata, KK and Rafi), 1942 – A LOVE STORY, KATI PATANG to certain extent, etc. though he gave some very mediocre music in films like DEEWAR, SHOLAY, KITAAB, ZAKHMEE, RAFOO CHAKKAR, NAMKEEN, DHARAM KARAM and BIWI O BIWI (so un-RK film like), etc. so many forgettable movies as for as music was concerned.
The irony of RDB was either he gave good music or petered out to a very mediocre music in so many films. I read some where that Shashi Kapoor called RD as National Anthem Music Director. In those days, theatres used to play National Anthem at the end of the movie and the Hall doors used to be shut till the completion of the Anthem. As soon as the Anthem used to commence, our in-disciplined people used to rush to the Hall Door and wait for the door opening. Similarly, whenever RDB songs commenced in most of the movies, people used to rush to toilet.
Still, it is not fair that we use harsh and sometimes, un-parliamentary language against any body if they differ with our views. We cannot forget the contribution of all these MDs, Heroes, Singers, Directors, etc. in making the Indian Film Music so rich.
Gurumurthy sir, Arghyaji and everyone:
Let’s also have to take into account the fact that all the herein referred MDs (with the possible exception of L-P) majorly used Rafisahab in duets during ‘those 5 years’.
as i think it is not important that how many songs sang by Mohd Rafi or KK under RD or LP or any one but the important thing is who is the singer who gave the most hit,if I am not wrong from 10 songs there should be 7 hit by Mohd Rafi but by kk as I think the songs became hit because the film was hit and from 10 songs maybe 3 hit(as I think) only because of Film hit.
from 1972 to 1976 kk songs mostly was hit because of film was hit but if we go to Mohd Rafi songs maybe we don’t remmber the flims but the songs still today are hit,
KK was a great singer also.
O P Nayar said that give one film I will show you who is Mohd Rafi and the same was done by Madan Mohan.
Mohd Rafi sang 16 songs for Big B(bachchan)If am not wrong 80% are hit and for Rajesh khanna 20 songs and 100% hit(as I think)
Arghyaji,
Nice comparison. As you have pointed out, KA and RDB definitley preferred KK over Rafi during those period. Add SDB also to the list. LP of course, tried to balance between Rafi and KK. Unfortunately, Rafi Music Directors like OPN, Naushad, Usha Khanna, Madan Mohan, Shankar Jaikishan, etc. did not have many films during that period.
Murthyji..
Post no. 990
Just saw statistics between 1972-76
LP gave Kishore 97 songs(Rafi 66) and KA gave Kishore 88 songs(Rafi 30!!almost one third)..RDB figures I did not dare to check up..If LP can give Kishore 97, RDB should be what?Approximately 150 numbers??
Dear Sirs,
Interesting discussions. But I fail to understand why any Music Director should prefer a particular singer at the cost of losing his own creativity? Or whether the particular Music Director was not comfortable with the all round singer, in this case Rafi. But it is a fact that Rafi has sung so many songs for RD Burman. The choice defies any logic.
I wish Rafiji had sung the following songs.
1. Mere Naina – Mehbooba.
2. All the songs of Kati Patang.
3. Maine Maanga Tuzhe Paya Hai – Deewar, especially the late entry of the male singer.
4. Most of the songs sung by Bhupinder for Gulzar movies.
Post No. 993.
I fully agree, but add that Rafi would have become the voice of Amitabh, Rishi (even in early seventies), etc. and the quality of songs in the seventies would not have deteriorated as Rafi would have sung most of the songs and Music Directors like RDB would have had full scope to exploit Rafi’s range.
To the hypothetical question of Post No. 992, a hypothetical answer.
1. Rafi would have reigned supreme even in the seventies.
2. Kishore would have been singing for himself as well as Dev Anand.
3. Rajesh Khanna would have made Rafi his voice.
4. Rafi’s total number of songs would have crossed perhaps 6000.
5. The quality of songs in the seventies would not have deteriorated to that extent.
After reading the statistics given in Post No. 990, one hypothetical question comes to mind. What if Rafiji had sung all the songs of Aradhana and Kati Patang as originally planned?
Nice piece of infor, murthy ji…
Do you have the figures for kishore for the same music directors in the same period 1972-76?? Although I am sure RD had used Kishore much more than Rafi, it would be interesting to know the figures of KA and LP.. As we rafinas claim LP had tried their level best to keep rafi afloat in that lean phase, it will be interesting to know Kishore’s figure under them vis-a-vis Rafi’s 66..
Dear Rafi Fans,
An amazing statistics. Before Aradhana, SDB gave Rafi 80 songs and afterwards just 8 songs. RDB during KK’s peek period (1972 to 76) gave Rafi 27 songs, KA 30 songs and LP 66 songs. Does this reveal something? Of course, LP were for Rafi that was known. But what about the other figures? Similarly if you look at the heroes who had Rafi as their Singer during this period fronm 1972 to 76, Dhramendra, Jeetendra, Sanjeev Kumar, Shahshi Kapoor, almost equallly share Rafiji.
Apart from the reason that Rafiji did not sing for 8 months, other reasons for decline of Rafi numbers during this period was the eclipse of Rafi heroes like Rajendra Kumar, Dilip Kumar, Biswajit, Joy Mukherjee, Pradeep Kumar, etc.
dear friends kindly visit my blog dedicated to our beloved mohmmed rafi saab
http://rafifanblog.blogspot.com/
Any true music lover would like all the Singers as they had their own specialities. Of course, it is an undisputed fact, even acknowledged by other Singers like Mannadey, Kishore Kumar, Mahendra Kapoor, etc. that capability-wise, Rafi was the best. The range which Music Directors wanted to attain with their Singers went up with the advent of Rafi and came down after Rafi departed from the scene.
No question of hating KK. He also gave us some wonderful songs to hum. But personally I like KK of pre-Aradhana days rather than post-Aradhana.
actually rafi sab and kishore were in good terms till their death. eveen after the death kk used to sing rafi saab’s song in his stage programmes.but one thing we should admit that the sound or voice of kk is poor in qauality as it is compared with rafi pmc panakkad
ref post 981:
dear arghya,
you seem to be unnecessarily stirring up the pot by making statements like “we love rafi less and hate kishore more”. Please note that some of us have been following rafi saab since the time when kishore was not even in the top 3 among the male singers. Some of us have attended rafi concerts when kishore used to be the warm-up act. From time to time, we point out the injustice that was meted out to him in the 70s; that’s all. We have nothing against kishore, but if some idiot comes to this site and makes comments like “kishore was better than rafi in classical songs”, we are not going to keep quiet.
I am just giving a web link here:
http://satyansh.com/smf/index.php?PHPSESSID=43cf8a2bd5a5ca91ecca48e227c46002&topic=13.0
Let us not feel defensive as rafians and go through the first paragraph of the article..I think when I said “we need to improve as Rafi fans by not hating Kishore”- to which all vehemently protested- will be somewhat justified..We may not think like this but unfortunately the world thinks us to think like that!!!
Dear Arghyaji,
That was a good observation. How it would have been if Rafi had sung those songs which ultimately was given to KK. One song which really comes to mind is “Tere Naina Sawan Bhadon” from “Mehabooba” sung by both KK and Lataji. Lataji’s version was far superior and I really feel Rafi should have sung that song and not KK. A clear case of wrong choice of Singer by RDB.
Most particularly, if I talked about any music director ditching rafi, it was SDB and not SJ… SJ, anyway, could not deliver that many hits in 70s as they did in 60s..I was (or rather I always will be) dissapointed with SDB- a person too big to be influenced by producers- who could have utilized Rafi better in songs like “Phoolon Ke Rang se”, “Khilte Hai Gool Yahan”, “Duniya O Duniya”(particulalrly),”Kaise Kahe hum”,”Tere mere milan Ki Yeh Raina”, “Badi Sooni Sooni Hai”- which he actually gave to kishore- only because kishore sang “Mere Sapno Ki Rani” and “Roop tera Mastana” for superhits??? How can he forget what Rafi did for him in “guide”, “teri soorat meri aankhein”,”baat ek raat ki”,”pyaasa”,”kagaz ke phhol”,”kala bazaar”,”kala pani”,”teen deviyan”,”talaash”,”solva saal”..and what not?
Dear ANIL ji…
Pl excuse me for my extrovertism! But you may not be like this, I may not be like this, murthyji may not be like this..but there are people!! Just visit Mohd. rafi fan club in Orkut(I am also a memebr alongwith 24,00 odd die hard rafi fans).. They always talk of how KK performed bad and Rafi could have done better!! Why should we, my dear? And I also admit, they are mainly youngsters..Not matured people like us.. RAFISAAB WAS THE BEST!!!! Should it be reminded to all the world? That day someone was discussing how Rafi saab could have sung “Bhanwre Ki Gunjan” better than Kishore had he been given a chance!!! Why should we? I never think “Bhanwre Ki Gunjan” by SJ came any closer to ” Teri Pyari Pyari Soorat Ko” which they composed for Rafi!! Then why should we be sorry???!!!
Pardon me if I got a bit personal! But i think this young generation need a re-lesson on the Farishta -e- saaz!!
Fab post, Manishji. But I still feel SDB could have been fairer with the ‘baadshah’. I mean he could have done a balancing act (like what LP were doing in the early ’70s) instead of completely (more or less) ignoring the one who was so much instrumental in creating the ‘SDB’ brand.
BTW, I’m fully with you on the relative inconsistency of Rafisahab’s voice in the ’70s. May I request you to throw some light on the topic? For instance could you list some of the songs were Rafisahab’s voice is 60-sque and some others where the voice is, may be, a bit off-peak? Better still, could you start a fresh post on it?
Dear Murthyji..
Listening this, I am the happiest person in this world!
Let us talk more about rafi in this forum, and less of others- this is my appeal to all other rafi fans like me!
Rafi saab amar rahe…
ref 975
Take every single line from me starting with “IMO”.
Relationship between MD & singer is not black and white. RD Burman had good regards for Rafi in terms of music and on a personal level. It’s just that he was an even bigger Kishore fan according to his personal tastes & preferences. Nothing more. It’s kind of like me being a Rafi fan. 90% of the songs I listen to are Rafi but this doesn’t mean that I don’t have regards for Mukesh (I do) or that I won’t opt for Mukesh instead of Rafi (I do occasionally from time to time).
To correct a few mistakes:
SD did not ditch Rafi for Aradhana and the talk of SD falling ill during Aradhana is exaggerated. Rafi recorded the first two songs and then went MIA on world tour. SD could not wait for Rafi to return and turned to Kishore. SD got Kishore to rehearse the songs and was a tough task master. He threatened that if Kishore did not meet his expectations, SD would instead wait for Rafi to return from world tour (source is KK book by Derek Bose). Luckily Kishore worked hard and the rest is history.
Never in the *1960s* did producers *not* want Raf & Lata to sing.
Shankar Jaikishan remained loyal to Rafi in the 1970s. They treated Rafi just like LP. Didn’t want to move away from him but circumstances forced them to *partially* do so. (1) Aradhana wave caused producers to demand MDs to use Kishore (2) There was a new style & trend for which Kishore was best suited for. Zindagi Ek Safar Hai Suhana would not have been as big of a *chartbuster in 1971* if it wasn’t rendered by Kishore and picturized on Rajesh Khanna. Taking advantage of Kishore’s talent & wave is not the same thing as ditching Rafi is you ask me (3) Rafi was out of recording rooms for 8 months during his Haj. None of this is to deny that Kishore was hot stuff in the 70s and all MDs (including LP, SJ) wanted to use him for their own good. They did. But SJ & LP never forgot Rafi’s contributions or failed to realize his unique abilities. At all times, SJ were most comfortable working with Rafi. This opinion is supported by subsequent interviews of Shankar even after Jaikishan passed away. Rafi no longer had a monopoly under the LP & SJ baton. It just wasn’t possible. Big banners could not afford to ignore Kishore in the 70s. But this is not the same thing as ditching Rafi. It’s impossible for SJ to forget a singer with whom they enjoyed *20+ years* of excellent chemistry, music, and *enormous* success. They become family. It’s just illogical to think otherwise (I apologize if I sound pompous there – not my intention).
People give the Aradhana wave too much weight. It was relevant in 1971 and even today but not to the same extent. Songs of Rafi that didn’t reach the charts in 1971 are evergreen gems today. Some songs of Kishore in the 1970s that overshadowed Rafi’s gems in 1971 (think Aap Aaye Bahaar Aaye or Mehboob Ki Mehndi) suffer the reverse fate. No one likes to hear the same voice again and again. People want change from time to time. We had discussed this earlier. Take your favorite dish and eat only that for the next 2 weeks. Of course you’re going to want to eat something different! That’s what happened with Rafi. Kishore’s success more so helped Kishore than to hurt Rafi. Kishore held his niche and Rafi held his. That’s why in the 1970s Kishore had ~1200 songs and Rafi ~1050 (I don’t remember exact numbers but you get the point). Not much difference. 4 years of Binaca Geet Mala charts isn’t much when you compare it to a 30 year career. It’s not much when you consider that people to this day still cherish the Rafi songs of the early 1970s. That’s all that matters now. That’s the true substance. The same applies for Kishore and the gems he gave us in that period.
To summarize everything in a nutshell I’ll liken it all to me: I am a big Rafi fan who can listen to 40 of his songs straight in one single evening while I’m on my desk woking. After the 50th song, I too need a change. I want a different voice or style so I turn to Kishore. Now am I ditching Rafi here? No. Is Kishore all of a sudden a “better singer” than Rafi for me? No. I just want a little bit of change. My preferences and whims shift from time to time. It’s not black and white. Just like how RD Burman sometimes opted for Rafi in the late 1970s etc.
I would extend all this to SD Burman, Chitragupta, etc. Everyone wants change for a while and they had to acknowledge the new wave of music that Kishore was so good for. And perhaps Rafi’s limited presence in SD’s baton in the 1970s was a result of SD in his final years of ill health and requiring help from RD Burman. RD Burman was naturally more comfortable with Kishore (does not equal ill will to Rafi) and SD loved Kishore and Kishore was hot stuff so why not use him after all?
Don’t take my post as apologetic or revisionists. I don’t care to do that. I’m a very proud Mohammed Rafi fan. I accept some things that aren’t always positive. Even I accept that Rafi’s voice in the 70s was not as consistent as it was in the 1960s. The other day I was listening to an oustanding RD Burman composition from Phandebaaz – Rafi & Lata in “Duniya Mein Paisa Bina”. While Rafi did a good job, I feel he could have done even much better with his voice quality from 1961. It would have been even clearer, velvetier, and more robust.
Finally, I agree that we Rafi fans should give even more focus to Rafi first and foremost. There are fans like Mr. HV Guru Murthy who set exemplary examples by pouring his heart and writing article after article for everyone to enjoy. Rafi fans should always look up on Mount Everest.
Arghyaji:
I’m with Gurumurthy sir when he says that we are lovers of good music and haters of none. I don’t know how you came to the conclusion that we are more KK haters than Rafi lovers and we hate all who supported KK. Actually we all are very much KK (and for that matter all the greats of the golden era, as explained by Gurumurthy sir) lovers. Personally, I’m angry with the father and son for their shabby treatment of the ‘farishta’ (if there is ever one), but hate them? no way. How can a music lover hate the creators of ‘aise to na dekho….’ or ‘tere mere sapne…’ or ‘mere naina sawan bhado….’? And who is jealous of KK and who is abusing any MD for doing what they did to Rafi sahab? We are only discussing history (a very interesting piece of it, infact) here and I’m sure you were also doing only the same thing in your post# 972.
Dear Arghyaji,
Well, I beg to differ. We have a Rafi Fan Club in Bangalore as well as an e-mail group where we exchange lot of notes on Hindi Film Music. No one hates KK, on the otherhand, we like songs of all singers like KK, HK, TM, Mannadey, Lata, Asha, MK, Mukesh, etc. In fact, on 19th December, many Rafi Fan Club Members were sitting together and enjoying Hemant Kumar and Talat Mohammed songs at ADA Rangamandira, Bangalore for about three hours. You should have been there to see for yourself the enthusiasm with which each song was welcomed. Good music is good music irerspective of the Singer. Well, we are of the opinion and I am sure you will also agree that all those singers of forties, fiftees, sixties and seventies were good, but Rafi was the best talentwise who could sing any type of song.
Dear murthy ji..
Thanks for understanding my views..
I think the problem with us-the rafi fans is that we love rafi less and hate kishore more!!! at least, that is what i can make out after reading the comments and posts here..And in the course of doing so, we start hating all the elements that helped kishore reach on top(music directors, producers, actors, music quality of 70s etc.).. Why are we sounding so jealous? What had happened had happened..In spite of all these, we all know Rafi saab was the best..so why should we be jealous of kishore? and that is what kishore fans find funny(i do interact with them)..
Let us rather encourage the young generation to listen to rafi more, promote his songs, share his stories to inspire youngsters..That will be the most befitting tribute to him, rather than accusing who had done what..
And if RDB is to be blamed, then why not our own favourite Shankar Jaikshen? Where was Shankar’s(Jaikishen died in 1971) loyality to Rafi in 70s?
Do i need to comment more on this?
Dear Arghyaji,
I fully agree with you. In fact, during the so called lean phase of Rafi, RDB gave more songs to Rafi as compared to SDB. You are correct, SDB ditched Rafi especially when he wanted the support of his Music Directors who made use of him to climb the ladder. In fact, only Usha Khanna and Madan Mohan and to a certain extent LP and KA used Rafi during that period.
whoever feels the chemistry with whomsoever, shouldn’t create any nuisance as we hv always got the best of the music…be it rafi g or hemant g or kk,,,,everybody has a different voice so it was all upto the md’s who found any niche in the voice and selected the best one for them…
Everyone pointing to RDB for his inclination towards KK and praising SDB rather for the latter’s choice of singers didn’t get digested properly by me..Sorry to say, but it was SDB who actually ditched Rafi and not RDB.. RDB might have used Rafi more before 70s, but remember KK was always there..He had given KK good numbers in Bhoot Bangla, Padosan, Abhilasha,Pyar Ka Mausam(pre-Aradhana era)..So, when producers turned favourable to KK, he got the opportunity to explore KK’s voice in a better way..
But what about SDB? What happened to him after Aradhana? Upto 1969, rafi had sung 80 numbers for SDB and KK had 40. When SDB died in 1975, the numbers stood at 88 for Rafi and 111 for KK!! What a whopping change in preference! From 70-75 he gave KK 71 songs to sing and only 8 to Rafi!!?? Where was his choice of male singers which you all people are claiming? And don’t tell me SDB was under pressure from producers.. He never was! He never was in 1950s, when he made KK to sing “Dukhi Man Mere” or in 1960s when he made rafi and lata sing a duet-when nobody wanted that to happen!!
SDB came out with box office chartbusters like Prem Pujari, Sharmilee, Gambler, Abhimaan,Mili,Sagina,Jugnu in 70s all with KK as the first lie male voice… I would never be convinced on any of you people’s logic that “It was producer’s pressure or Lata-Asha politics”– this could never happen with SDB. What mostly could be done was what happened in Aradhana, sDB fell ill and RDB replacing Rafi with Kishore.. But from 1970-1975, SDB worked in around 21 films, and you can’t expect in every film RDB playing nuisance and replacing KK who was averaging around 3-4 songs in SDB films in 1970s!!
So, please friends, I think it was SD Burman who exploited Rafi. In 1960s he took major benefits from him in films like tere ghar ke samne, guide, kala bazaar, teri soorat meri aankhein, ziddi, talash, baat ek raat ki, teen deviyan etc. and then playing a different game in 1970s to change his preference altogether!!!!
Sanjay Aroraji,
I am eagerly waiting for the songs mentioned. Please send them to either hvgurumurthy@yahoo.co.in or hvguru@bhelepd.com.
ref mail 969.unable to send you the requred songs,as your mailing address
hvgurumurthy@yahoo.co.in is not accepting mails, I have a mail failure for your mail address,please provide me alternate mailing address,my mail address is
arorasanjay1@rediffmail.com
and mobile no is 9869059998
Sanjay Aroraji,
Thank you very much. I am eagerly awaiting your mail. Infact, Mr. Narayananji suggetsed me to contact you but unfortunately I did not have your contact no. and mail id. Incidentally can you please clarify whether this Music Director Bhushan and the MD Brij Bhushan of MILAP are one and the same. Milap had some wonderful songs like Rafi’s Kahin Aisa Na Ho, Mukesh’s Kai Sadiyonse and Ash’s Nazariya. If you have MILAP songs, pease mail me them too.
REF MAIL 97,DEAR MURTHY SAHAB I SHALL BE SHORTLY MAILING TO YOU THE DESIRED SONG BUT ALSO THE RAFI SAAB -ASHA DUET `YEH NA HAMSE POOCHIYE` FROM THE SAME FILM ,INCIDENTLY THE MD WAS` BHUSHAN`
AND HE HAD ONLY ONE MORE RELEASE`MEHFIL`
Dear Rafi Bhakton,
I am sorry to bother with this request.
I am on the lookout for a Rafi solo for a long time, details of which are given below.
Name of the movie – Purani Pehchaan.
Year of release – 1971.
Stars – Sanjeev Kumar & Tanuja.
Mukhda of the song – Ae Jaane Bahara Roohe Chaman
Pehlume Mere Kab Aaogi
Chandan Ki Tarah Mehakega Badan
Tum Aur Hasin Ho Jaogi
If you have the song, please mail it to me at hvgurumurthy@yahoo.co.in
Regards.
H.V.GURU MURTHY
Whether RDB preferred KK over Rafi Sahaab or not pales into insignificance before the actual historical fact. This fact is that no one could keep Rafi Sahaab down, not even himself, when after performing the Hajj he was trapped into the Hamletian dilemma of whether to sing or not. Thus he kept himself away from the recording studios and in fact went away to London. It was this wilful absence of Rafi Sahaab that provided an open field to other playback singers, notably KK. In the Mumbai film industry where producers had to borrow large sums of money at usurious rate, they or the music directors could not wait for Rafi Sahaab for that would have incurred very heavy financial losses for them. But once Rafi Sahaab was prevailed upon to come back by his well-wishers, including his own children, that Rafi Sahaab proved once again to the world his unique position of being No.1 before his premature death in 1980 notwithstanding the fact he did not win Filmfare Awards that year for his outstanding songs. Even RDB had to come back to Rafi Sahaab in a big way once again.
NASIR.
post 962 Akash,
Aradhana definitely had an impact for Kishore. As for Rafi, frankly, IMO, Aradhana & Rajesh Khanna had very little impact on Rafi directly from 1976 and after. A win for Kishore does not = a loss for Rafi (or vice versa). The 70s needed *both* singers to fill each of his unique niche / trait. Aradhana’s impact for Rafi was from 1971-1975 which is a very short time window when you actually think of it. Even the “impact” is subjective. For me personally, as a Rafi fan today, even in that period the “impact” was very limited because Rafi Sahab continued to deliver great songs that please my years. He continued to enthrall his fans. Had this ceased in any way, then I may have agreed with you more. For me personally, Binaca Geet Mala or whatever back in the day have no bearing because they have nothing to do with me as I wasn’t even alive back then. All that matters to me is the evergreen songs of Rafi from that period that remain to this day after the waves have ceased. Each to his own my friend.
Post 962: Nothing was changed, Mohammed Rafi Saheb was on top till 1980. KK had 3rd rated songs quality wise.
Post No. 960: Gurumurthyji, it is not that Mohammed Rafi was not ready to sing the Zanjeer song ‘Deewaane hain deewanon ko naa ghar chaahiye…’. The song was already recrded but Lataji and music directors (Kalyaanji Anandji) felt that there were some weak points in the song and they wanted to re-record the song. But Rafi saab refused to sing again as he was little unwell owing his being on fast (as those were ramzaan days). It was then that Gulshan Bawraa told him that the song was to be picturized on him. On that Rafiji exclaimed – “Pehle Kyon Nahin Bola†and he re-recorded the song with full gusto without allowing his ill-health adversely affect the singing quality. There is not a slightest hint of Rafi saab being unwell.
Mr. Binu Nair – 957
Your comments aradhana and rajesh khanna do not happen every day – but the day on which it happened changed the course for the rest of the career for both singers.
post 960…..
gurumurthy ji… mohd rafi and lata were the singers chosen for the song of zanzeer….. its a lovely song. the recording was done during the holy month of ramzan and mohd rafi was tired after the recording due to his “roza” meaning fast. he wanted to leave soon after the recording but it seems there was a technical hitch or a manufactured hitch, cant say for sure due to the players involved.
when mohd rafi announced that he is leaving after the take, gulshan bawra ran after mohd rafi and pleaded to come back as the song was to be picturised on him. the tired veteran forgot about his fasting, came back and re-recorded the song. this is what gulshan bawra claimed in an interview.
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we are issueing the sargam magazine on jan 26th and regrets the delays in issueing it.
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binu nair…
Chriyanji,
I read somewhere that Rafi Saab some how was not ready to sing the Zanjeer song, but Gulshan Bawra, the Lyricist informed Rafi that the song will be picturised on him, for which it seems Rafiji exclaimed – “Pehle Kyon Nahin Bola” and he recorded the song.
I had so far stayed away from all controversies in this site generally and specifically on RDB-KK VS RAFI mainly because I think this site should focus only on the finer points in Rafi sahab’s singing rather than going into endless controversies.
I am adding few lines just to try to put in proper prespective why there are so many comments on the RDB hype. This is purely due to the fact that for any average Indian knows only 1 or 2 music directors by name and RDB is one of them. That was due to the hype created in media. In that bargain all veterans like Naushad, SDB,S-J, Roshan , Madan mohan, Ravi, OPN, K-A,L-P , Khayyam, Jaidev, Chitragupta –oh the list is so long..got fogotten by the majority. Here ,when I say the average Indian / majority-please note I am not talking about the ardent lovers of old hindi songs who do know about all these music directors.
A general impression was there that music director means RDB , singer means Kishore. We have nothing against them-in fact I listen(and like me I am sure many of my fellow Rafi fans also) to all music directors’ and singers songs composed till early 80’s. There are certain songs which Kishore, Mukesh, Hemant Kumar, Manna Dey, Mahendra Kapoor had sung beautifully–in fact each one had a unqiue style and originality. But there is a major, major point which makes us love Rafi sahab so much -the way his songs touch-please note –touch the heart directly. That is beacuse he sang by putting his soul into his songs. That is the secret of his evergreen appeal.
Just to highlight this aspect, the other day I was listening to two songs of Rafi sahab consecutively-one was an intensely patriotic “Kar chale hum fida ” and the other “Tum se kahoon ek baat paron se halke..”. One was at the Everest and the other at the lowest point of earth at the Pacific ocean!!
More than the technical wizardy of pitches, you really feel the patriotism and romance in both these songs. That, to sum up is Rafi sahab.
r
Prabhanjan:
You’ve summed it up very well.
Speaking of ‘deewane hai deewanon ko….’ song, I was watching it just now and as you described, it’s a nice song very well executed (in a modulated voice) by the ‘baadshah’. I think it’s one among the many gems that got submerged in the ‘wave’ that was on at that point of time.
rdb used mohd rafi while he was ascending the music ladder and then forgot mohd rafi. then, when things slided down very badly for rdb, he remembered mohd rafi once again. and, here was rafi saaheb crooning : ” Kya huwa terea waada, woh kasam woh irada ” getting the national award for the song.
rdb was at pains and in dilemma, whether to celebrate the success or look back at lost opportunities of working with mohd rafi. Most probably rdb the trend setter failed to read the “sound of music” as loved by indian masses and had a mighty fall.
aradhana and rajesh khanna does’nt happen every day , rdb realised a tad late in the day.
binu nair. mumbai, rafi foundation.
Post 950
Hi Debapriya,
You were talking of RDB living in people’s hearts after 14 yrs 11 months after his demise. What do you have to say about Rafi living in the hearts of millions across the world even after 28 years of his demise?
You already know the answer to many of your doubts about Rafi. You spoke about “depth”. Exactly! You need to have that depth to appreciate the phenomenon called Rafi. I dont blame you – unfortunately, not many have it in them to appreciate Rafi’s talent and class. And it is this depth which separates the men from the boys. When you talk of great composers, talk about Madan Mohan, Naushad, OPN, SJ, SDB, LP, Ravi, Roshan, Khayyam, Chitragupt… oh, the list is endless. Sure, RDB was good, but to go gaga over RDB and claiming he is the best is so juvenile. I wish you are blessed with that depth sometime in your lifetime.
Till then… happy tarzan cries of RDB 🙂
Cheers
Anoop
Post No. 950., Debapriya Dattaji,
You seem to be a die hard RD fan and want to defend RDB at any cost. Of course, it is your prerogative. No body doubted RDB’s talent. What all are disappointed with his choice of Singers. Of course, RDB gave some wonderful hits with KK like Aandhi, Zameer, Mere Jeevan Sathi, etc. but so many trash also. If you take the song of Mehbooba – Mere Naina Sawan Bhadon, Lata is head and shoulder above KK. In fact, here the singer should have been Rafi as Rafi was more trained for a classical song than KK. The KK version was not a great song as compared to Lata version, which was definitely very good. Here only, RDB lost out. And there are lot many more such cases. The National Anthem music director thing was told by none other than Shashi Kapoor himself.
Ref Post 948:
Mr. Cherian, as much as I love RD, I love L-P the same way. For me, they are brilliant MD’s, and have many outstanding tunes to their credit. I’d say L-P’s highs (overall) are definitely as towering as RD’s highs, and many of those high’s also surprass RD’s highs too.
i seriously dont WISH that rd used rafi – rd used rafi enough for me.. gulaabi aankhen, teesri manzil, maine poocha chand se, hum kisi se kum nahin, chura liya hain tumne..
i mainly listen to the shankar jaikishan, op nayyar and mostly laxmikant pyarelal’s compositions..
rd can use whoever he wants.. he used rafi for shammi and kishore for rajesh..
posst 950…. most of the “dabba” songs of r d burman is being lauded by pancham fans, asha bhosle and the media – to be the greatest songs of rdb in this century. people in general and music lovers are not so much dumb to accept all of r.d.b works as priceless jewels. there was good music and thrash music from r.d.b.
pancham’s penchant on using asha his wife and kishore kumar – misfired and he lost his music, his hits, his composure and everything else. no doubt he created a niche in the music field and made a big name for himself in the seventies . panchams rise to fame was fast and speedy; his fall too was mighty fast. a coin has two sides dear writer of post 950 , please note….
binu nair
@DEBAPRIYA DATTA
You got it completely wrong the jist of all the messages. One reason may be that you have not probably gone through each post here, otherwise you would not have remarked so.
You see, if you pick RDB’s top 20 songs, Rafi and KK, more or less, share the spoils. Compare this with the fact that KK sung about 400 songs against Rafi’s 100 songs for RDB. Post Aradhana, the use of Rafi by RDB was almost null upto HKKN. One the other hand, if u list out Rafi’s top 50, hardly there will be any RDB song. In this period, and justifiably, RDB gave out really good gems. Where he failed was the number of crap songs was also too high. By 1976, RDB+KK magic declined to a very large extent, and it was during period Rafi came back strongly,and RDB was forced to use Rafi, and was back in business. Again, after Rafi’s demise in 1980, RBD was back to the horrible form, and though he gave a few good songs, he supplied with them a lot of trash songs. It is in light of all these facts, we BELIEVE that RDB would have been even more successful if he had use Rafi more. And this belief of ours has been wrongly interpretted by many KK fans as if we say all KK+RDB songs should have been sung by Rafi. Come to think of this. Why no serious follower of music feels the same about SJ+Mukesh, LP+KK, o etc combos? Or even SDB+KK? The fact is SJ, LP, SDB were very judicious about the choice of singers, and it is here we feel RDB erred a lot in giving more songs to KK. If you feel otherwise, we welcome your taste.
@rafians: BTW, I have always felt that Rafi-Lata duet in Zanjeer is very very underrated, that is the song, “Deewane hai deewane ko na ghar chahiye”. Why is that so? And so is Rafi solo from Awara, “naiyaa teri majhdhar”.